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David Poland

By David Poland poland@moviecitynews.com

Friday Estimates by Klady

friest082608.jpg
What can one say about The Dark Knight‘s number? The film is about $477 million ahead of the previous highest 8 day grosser in history.
In spite of what seened to many to be a low key campaign, Step Brothers will open in the top group of Ferrell numbers, really only overshadowed by Talladega Nights.
X-Files 2: I Want To Know Why They Thought Someone Was Coming is a bit of a wreck. Patrick Goldstein’s obsession with Fox’s Rotten Tomato scores will continue and be supported by another lame box office showing. Still… this is the tough walk of all studios. Last year, tehy scored a massive worldwide hit with a TV show that was still on the air, The Simpsons. This year, they get Chris Carter and a franchise that once had a cult behind it… and boom. (Perhaps the first question is why the studio released a film to this demo during ComicCon… the crowd there represents as much as another million at the box office… which in a situation like this, actually matters.)
Mamma Mia! is now edging out Hairspray for bragging rights to being #3 muisical of all time… and more importantly, a gross of over $120 million. People keep wanting to lazily blame the popularity of the musical on stage, but that has not been a sure bet in the past. I still give Universal marketing ALL the credit. They have positioned and continue to position the film as a light, happy alternative for women in a very dark summer. Yes, it sucks. But if you are a woman and you want to go to the movies and want something light, what the hell else is there for you in theaters?
Hancock passed $200m and Wall-E is almost there, but they seem to have had some life sucked out of them by The Dark Knight. Hellboy 2 passed the first film’s total gross, domestically, in the last couple of days… but Batman and a market that seems to be just about at the limit – between $70m and $90m for the franchise, max, even though Guillermo is brilliant and created some of the summer’s finest images – make the box office somewhat of a dissapointment for Universal, which ended up kicking in a lot more (30%+) to make the film than oriiginally intended. International on the first was 2/3 of the domestic… U will hope to build on that this time out with a bigger visual feast.
The folks left at Paramount Vantage and their bosses who moved to The Big Show pushed hard on American Teen… but it seems to be a prank call. The film will be fortunate to do $7000 per screen on 5 screens. To offer perspective, the company’s Shine A Light (the Scorsese Stones doc) opened on 276 screens to $5391 per screen. Trumbo opened a few weeks ago on 3 screens and did $9375 per. Young @ Heart opened to $12,734 per screen on 4 this spring. So we don’t know exactly where Teen is going from here. But with some scathing critical reviews – too scathing, too unkind, too suspicious – and no apparent luck in getting around art house habits (where critics still matter) to find an audience of teens, it doesn’t look good. Fortunately, if it loses money – and there’s always DVD – it will be a minor note on the Lesher list of cash drains (which includes money-loser Babel, which some blooger credited with being past the red ink the other day). Deck chairs on the Titanic, folks.

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118 Responses to “Friday Estimates by Klady”

  1. Blackcloud says:

    Ouch for the X-Files, but can’t say I’m surprised. Am surprised that Wall*E seems to be listing a bit on its way to 200 million.

  2. EthanG says:

    Well DP…it looks like Fox’s ability to peddle crap has finally reached its end….3 flops in 3 weeks, with X-Files a disaster and Meet Dave a catastrophe. Heads are going to roll after Babylon AD.
    That’s about what was expected for TDK…maybe a bit steeper. Milestones it’ll have reached by weekend’s end: #1 Batman film, #2 Batman film adjusted for inflation, and possibly #1 film of 2008.

  3. EthanG says:

    Oh…and $30 million+ opening for R-rated comedy makes Semi-Pro appear a fluke. What people want in a Ferrell comedy really is hard to predict…

  4. Even as someone who kinda liked Semi-Pro (the director’s cut especially worked better as a light Woody Harrelson drama than a wacked-out Will Ferrell comedy), the marketing for Step-Brothers was far superior in every way. A clear knowledge of what the movie was about, those clever video posters, and jokes that you could actually put in the trailer (yes it was R too, but Semi-Pro’s jokes were the sort you couldn’t put in a trailer).
    As for X-Files, I saw it yesterday morning, and unless they get more money, get an R rating, or bring in Martin Campbell to revitalize the franchise, I’ll be waiting till BluRay next time (it’s not a ghastly movie, just a very cheap-looking, slow and mediocre one).

  5. abba_70s says:

    Personally, I was VERY disappointed with STEP BROTHERS. If you didn’t buy into the premise of these two 40 year olds still living at home not acting like atypical 40 year olds, well….
    …and the horrible music ending…sigh…
    But the scene involving Will Ferrell and the drums was pure genius…

  6. David Poland says:

    Ethan… Fox has weathered these moments before. One thing about studios… people don’t tend to get fired in the face of failure. They get fired in the lulls.
    Tom and Jim are 95% safe with next year’s slate looming. If they were to fail with 3 of their 5 tentpoles, then they would be pushed out.
    Fox marketing is, as always, in endless upheaval, and has always been able to pull itself out with the argument that they can’t sell shitty movies… and then they get one surprise and they are back in the good graces.
    Anyway… 2009 is the year that Fox is looking to. If they fail next year, things change. If not, not.
    Same with Paramount, by the way, though the more important event is the DW separation and how that moves or doesn’t move the stock price.
    Sony has created its own transition, with Jeff Blake still on top of it. Van Galder and Weinstock can sell the stinky stuff better than anyone in town.
    Universal is doing fine, hitting for a good average right now – with product that is all double, no home runs – though the company may still be sold off.
    Sue Kroll has many people questioning her methods at WB, but The Dark Knight will “prove her right” and Potter will make her reign strong for a couple of years.
    Disney is happy and internal, though not a place for the overly ambitious.
    And MGM will have a major’s marketing dept again soon.

  7. the keoki says:

    remind me why 2009 is Fox’s year? i’m truly drawing a blank on what’s coming out.

  8. David Poland says:

    Australia
    The Day the Earth Stood Still
    Dragonball
    X-Men Origins: Wolverine
    Night at the Museum II
    Ice Age: Dawn of the Dinosaurs
    Avatar

  9. Did I miss the news that Australia was pushed to next year or something?

  10. Blackcloud says:

    I wonder if Fox will regret passing on “Clone Wars.” We’ll find out in a few weeks.

  11. chris says:

    On its way to that $120, “Mamma Mia” slides by “The Queen”‘s gross today. Just sayin’.

  12. Wrecktum says:

    Australia is an FY09 release.
    Excellent (and accurate) rundown of the current state of the studios, Poland.

  13. EthanG says:

    Australia and Day are coming out this year…though the majority of Day’s gross will fall into 2009.
    Dave, I completely agree with you next summer’s slate looks to be dominated by Fox…however they are going to need it. They have to have had one of the worst major studio summers in recent memory. The success of What Happens in Vegas is well more than offset by the wreckage of Deception, Meet Dave and now The X-Files.
    But I do think the possibility of jobs being lost is there, especially if the reported budgets on Babylon (originally $60 million but reportedly waaaay over that after production delays), City of Ember (around $75 million) and Australia (at least $100 million…you really think this is going to be profitable when Baz almost never has?) are true.
    Not to mention the slate over the next few months is really nasty overall aside from Max Payne….(bumping Bride Wars to the dead of January ?)
    I agree Goldstein’s streak is meaningless, but it’s fun nonetheless with Fox at 17 straight rotten films and counting…with 3 clunkers in August (Mirrors, The Rocker and Babylon) it’s going to be awhile.

  14. Dr Wally says:

    Okay, i just got back from TDK, having waited until i could get into an IMAX screening. Utterly awesome. This is the best Summer event blockbuster since Jurassic Park a long fifteen years ago. Well done Christopher Nolan and thank you very much.

  15. EthanG says:

    Last notes on Fox…I promise. And no, I’m not Goldstein.
    1. Fox buried the theatre count on Meet Dave this weekend, hoping no one will notice in the Monday finals, likely because it broke the record for biggest count drop.
    2. Just as fun a streak, and a better indication of where Fox stands: this will be their 18th straight week without a #1 film, making them the only major without one week this summer. In that time, Lionsgate, MGM and the defunct New Line have had #1’s as well.

  16. jeffmcm says:

    I hate to point out out because I love Pixar as much as anyone, but Wall-E was originally predicted to be ‘the biggest film of the summer’ by quite a few and now it looks like it’ll make less than Cars.
    What happened?

  17. the keoki says:

    i certainly thought WALL-E would be much farther along. kung-fu panda being better than folks anticipated has a part to play in it. does anyone think that parents were scared away warning of an almost silent first half? i know someone who said she wasn’t taking her two kids because of that. word of mouth seems kind of soft too. i have know idea why, i thought it was the second best film i’ve seen this year…guess the first.

  18. the keoki says:

    and thanks for the list DP. wow they have some heavy hitters coming. although 3 of those will be misses. austrailia won’t do it, keanu and gort are opening same day as twilight and they’ll get their ass kicked, and dragonball? no idea.

  19. IOIOIOI says:

    Those people were wrong Jeff. They simply under-sold the Bat, and Wall-E paid for it. These things happen all the time, but the BAT was always going to be the biggest movie of the Summer. You would just have to be foolish to have bet against it.

  20. the keoki says:

    it’s not that simple. nemo and pirates coexisted in ’03. it can’t just be blamed on the bat.

  21. jeffmcm says:

    I can see Hellboy and X-Files suffering from Batmania. Wall-E should have been immune (plus it was already underperforming before TDK came out, so facts intrude yet again).

  22. mutinyco says:

    The fact is, there were too many people who actively hated WALL*E. A lot of people hated the first 15 minutes and thought it was boring. A lot of people hated the green message. A lot of people hated the main character was a robot. Etc.
    It doesn’t matter how many people loved it. Those few who hated it weren’t afraid to express themselves.

  23. Josh Massey says:

    I’m not quite buying there are 150,000 people who chose to attend Comic-Con this weekend instead of seeing The X-Files.

  24. David Poland says:

    Maybe not 150k, Josh. But you get my point.
    The people who are at ComicCon are the people who make the committment to genre movies, no matter what. Maybe a third of them HATED X-Files. But even the energy going into the weekend… the people who might have been dragged along with them… etc.
    This goes against my general take on The Geek 8, except that in this case, they needed the Geek 8 and they are getting little of it. Had they sent Duchovney and Anderson to San Diego and opened the movie next week, after spraying the geeks and the media with his funny charm and her detached self-awareness, it would have been as smart a use of ComicCon as you can make.

  25. Joe Leydon says:

    Australia is going to be a massive hit, and a major Oscar contender. Seriously. A big, fat, four-quadrant hit.

  26. Bennett says:

    I am not surprised that WALL E is taking a dive. Despite the fact that it is also my second favorite film of the year, yeah guess my favorite is also, many parents and kids that I have talked to preferred Kung Fu Panda. I feel that Disney should be lucky that they passed 200 million with their SCI-FI ART GEEK Film. I hope that this does not discourage Pixar from making more films like WALL E.
    I had planned to see X-Files last night, being a big fan in the 90’s, but based on all the reviews and trailers, I just did not want to see a sub-par effort and ruining all those good memories(kinda a lesser extent Indy Jones Reaction), so I saw Wanted instead….It is funny Wanted had such a mish mash of special effects. The bullet effects were good…but several of the train and subway scenes had CGI so bad that it looked like a PS2 cut scene.
    I don’t think that anyone that says that TDK was going to be the number one film of the summer would be lying. All the summer previews that I have read basically said that Indy was going to bethe hit of the summer. PAR is gonna learn that making a quality sequel aka TDK will push you to 400-500 domestic. I have seen TDK twice now(once in IMAX) and I have not seen a movie twice in the theater since Finding Nemo. Begs the question if Nolan has a third Batman in his head, or if he will get out while ahead….I am sure that WB is begging and begging Nolan for a third…Wonder what TDK will do for T4 grosses…
    Not to kiss ass but I do agree with David that sending Carter, Dave and Gillian(who is still pretty damm hot…thank you Maxim) would help the grosses…But in hindsight probably just waiting for a better script might have been a better idea. At least Fox kept the Budget pretty tight so I am sure that it will make a small profit.

  27. movieman says:

    At the risk of being banned for life on MCN, can I just say that– for me anyway–“TDK” was the most overhyped and overrated movie of the season, if not the entire decade?
    Wow, that feels a whole lot better now that I’ve gotten that off my chest!
    Moving on…..that certainly wasn’t a particularly stellar opening day gross for “Brideshead Revisited,” was it? At this point, I’d say that it’s only Oscar chances might reside in a supporting nod for Emma Thompson.
    Has anyone seen “Pineapple Express”? I found its drug-addled comic rhythms to be consistently amusing, if not haha funny.
    At its best, it reminded of mid-70s Altman: loosely structured, prone to non sequitur tangents but a lovable shaggy dog of a movie nonetheless. And for my money, James Franco gives a more entertaining commedia dell’arte performance than Heath Ledger in “TDK.” It may be David Gordon Green’s least personal film to date, but it’s easily my favorite.
    Nice opening for the very funny “Step Brothers,” but Sandler’s “Zohan” remains my favorite comedy of the year so far.
    “Mamma Mia!” is the most ineptly directed B’way-to-screen transfer since “The Producers.” Yet, I’m glad that it’s continuing to do well as Bat-counterprogamming.
    Maybe it’s success will inspire a studio to take a chance on “Jersey Boys,” an infinitely superior jukebox musical. I just hope they don’t entrust it to original stage helmer Des McAnuff whose two previous stints as a film director (“Cousin Bette” and DeNiro’s “Rocky and Bullwinkle”) were both pretty abysmal.

  28. Bennett says:

    I hope that they put Wicked on the silver screen…I think that would be a huge success, with the right casting and director….Could a musical cross 200 million???

  29. movieman says:

    Yeah, I’d like to see a big-screen “Wicked,” too, Bennett.
    Of course, they’d have to do some major cutting of the book and straighten the narrative arc a tad.
    But it’s “Potter”-esque cult should easily translate to beaucoup box office bucks…unless, of course, it’s completely destroyed in the transer like “Rent” was by Chris Columbus.

  30. IOIOIOI says:

    Movieman: you will not be banned. You will just have to deal with me and my “POPPYCOCK” hand. You see it? Get a mental image in your mine. BAM! YOU’VE BEEN POPPYCOCKED!

  31. IOIOIOI says:

    That’s mind. Hold on. Think about it again movieman. Think about it in your wild paragraphed style… BAM! YOU’VE BEEN POPPYCOCKED AGAIN! HOT DAMN! I AM ON A POPPYCOCKIN HOT STREAK! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

  32. movieman says:

    …and what exactly is “poppycocked,” lol?

  33. Since you’re tossing out a contrarian opinion, I’d love to know why you felt the way you did. I’m not baiting, just curious. I married a woman who loves Batman & Robin, Grease 2, and A View To A Kill, so I’m very tolerant of opposing views.

  34. matro says:

    Australia will indeed be a massive hit.
    In Australia.

  35. David Poland says:

    I don’t know what movieman’s position is, but I can’t say that I don’t disgree with him by much.
    It’s not that the movie isn’t quite good and unique in many ways. But the hysteria is far beyond any movie I can think of in a long, long time. I can’t think of a film at the top of my Top Ten lists over the last decade that would actually be worthy of all of this drool… and I LOVE those films.
    I’m not saying that the film doesn’t deserve its box office success either. Box office is one thing. True greatness is another. If there has been a better studio film this year, the only one that it might be is Wall-E. (Yes, I know… some disagree. Cool.) But being the best of the first 7 months of a year doesn’t make a film the best of the decade, the last 30 years, or even, necessarily, of this year.
    Ironically, the only reason I keep bringing it up is that people on the web just won’t shut up already about how AMAZING the movie is. It’s a good movie! But – again – it fails in many of its wonderful aspirations. Better that than not trying… agreed. But geeeeez!!!

  36. David Poland says:

    Fox’s List – I started in November with the run of films that I expect to work for them. Not that complicated.
    I don’t know if Australia will be a smash, a flop, or a mediocrity at the box office… or critically, for that matter. But given the talent involved, it has a real shot at being the first real Out of Africa epic in quite a while. If it fails, it fails.

  37. IOIOIOI says:

    Movieman: it made you giggle, but I disagree with your take.
    Poland: you are… a HATER. It’s that simple. Your post in the other thread pretty much cemented what you are in my mind. You are nothing more than a man with a grudge towards a certain kind of film. Good for you.
    The thing of it is: it’s the best of the biggest GENRE OF THIS DECADE. It’s the flick that millions of people have wanted to see for well over decades, and it’s a movie that lives up to all of their hopes and aspirations. It’s everything and a bag of chips, as folks used to say back in the day.
    So the inability for you to grasp it’s greatness, is the same inability that you have with the movies you put up as great. When really, most of the time, you are proven wrong by not only the critical opinion, the box-office take, and the Academy.
    This really means that you are an Outsider. You should look into maybe finding another partner or two to play up your whole OUTSIDER take, make a web-show out of it, and bring some entertainment to the utterly ridiculous positions you hold on many movies.
    It fails? You to get the movie, but not the movie itself.

  38. IOIOIOI says:

    This should be your theme music. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSn57kO1FXk . You can be Hall, your first partner can be Nash, and the other can be Syxx. I see this being a really popular show with like 2 demos: people who hate comic book movies and people who hate geek culture.

  39. Joe Leydon says:

    Actually, as much as I enjoyed The Dark Knight, I found Hancock more emotionally affecting. Seriously.
    And as for Australia: I think David has it right with the Out of Africa reference. Australia looks to me like the sort of grand romantic gesture that we haven’t seen at the movies for a while. Know what? Just on the strength of seeing about 20 minutes of rough-cut footage, I’m willing to predict — right here, right now — a Best Picture nomination. And if I’m wrong, screw it, David can deal with the Phantom of the Opera gags. I can deal with Australia jokes.

  40. mutinyco says:

    Actually, IO, the genre of the decade was fantasy (Rings, Potter, Narnia, etc.). And it was Rings people were waiting decades for not Batman. And it was Rings that swept the Oscars.

  41. IOIOIOI says:

    Joe: hanging your hat with Baz, is better than hanging your hat with Joel.

  42. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: BULLFUCKINGSHIT.
    Let’s ignore for a minute that Batman precedes LOTR by a good 20 years. Let’s ignore for a moment that you can walk on damn near any street on this planet with a Batman shirt on, and they will know what it is. Let’s ignore for a moment that it was BATMAN that changed the home-video game.
    Let’s ignore how important BATMAN STILL IS and respond to this bullshit… FANTASY FILM? You mean those three films that look worse as the years go by, and those three films mostly about walking? Please.
    Comic-Book movies are the defining genre of this decade. People are still bringing up SPIDER-MAN in context to THE DARK KNIGHT, and SPIDER-MAN OPENED 6 FREAKIN YEARS AGO!
    Those LOTR films are all but forgotten by most folks. Their Oscars for a FX remain the biggest laughing stock of this decade outside of the Golden Compass FX Oscar, and let’s just giggle about the Academy giving the best picture to a film with 15 endings.
    The LOTR films couldn’t carry TDK or BEGINS jock. YOU’VE JUST BEEN POPPYCOCKED.

  43. mutinyco says:

    IO, I’m not taking your bait the way others do.
    You’re wrong. As any intelligent person will agree.

  44. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: let me explain something to you and every other asshole out there. I am not one to goad motherfuckers. I am one for a good fight.
    Your argument is preposterous on a sheer BOX-OFFICE level. Please point out to me what’s made more? The Comic-Book movies or the Fantasy movies? Hell… the possible biggest movie of this decade could possibly be a freakin COMIC BOOK MOVIE, and you are going to go with the Fantasy films? Please.
    The Comic Book movies are what have driven this decade ever since the Spider squated in front of that flag. They will be what continues to drive the box office well into the next decade. While the Fantasy films will come to and end.
    So any intelligent person will simply disagree with you. They would be silly to agree with you. Especially your Oscar argument about Fantasy films because THOSE FILMS ARE OVERRATED. Easily the most over-lavished and over-hyped flicks to come out of Hollywood in years.

  45. Rob says:

    Wait, I’m so lost…what’s the difference between a comic book movie and a fantasy movie? And why are we pitting genres against each other? And why are we shunning people who like The Dark Knight but don’t think it’s the Second Coming?

  46. Hallick says:

    “Ironically, the only reason I keep bringing it up is that people on the web just won’t shut up already about how AMAZING the movie is.”
    So? Some people never shut up about how AMAZING Godfather II is too. But the true reason you keep bringing this one up is the simple fact that, in The Dark Knight’s case, you’re just not feeling it at all. Which I understand and don’t feel much like taking you task for, unlike others who (sometimes BOORISHLY) want to see you crawl across a sea of broken glass and kiss this movie’s ring in obeisance to it’s utter, undeniable greatness (a greatness I personally believe whole-heartedly in).
    But at some point, you’re going to have to agree to disagree here. It isn’t just the web, and it isn’t just the geek crowd. I’ve talked to a lot of different people and I gotta say that this love is the genuine article across the board. I had to suffer it for a week, wondering what the hell everybody put in their Kool-Aid, before I saw the movie itself and became a convert, so I do empathize with your plight. But the cheese is standing pretty much alone with you.
    Still, your counter-opinion is more than welcome in the face of some of the frothing-at-the-mouth-and-buttocks that’s arisen.

  47. Hallick says:

    “Wait, I’m so lost…what’s the difference between a comic book movie and a fantasy movie? And why are we pitting genres against each other? And why are we shunning people who like The Dark Knight but don’t think it’s the Second Coming?”
    Because zealotry is the new American pastime.

  48. mutinyco says:

    Rings:
    1) 861M (4 Oscars)
    2) 922M (2 Oscars)
    3) 1.13B (11 Oscars)
    Potter:
    1) 969M
    2) 866M
    3) 789M
    4) 892M
    5) 937M
    Narnia:
    1) 739M
    2) 370M
    ******
    Spider-Man:
    1) 807M
    2) 784M (1 Oscar)
    3) 885M
    Batman:
    1) 352M
    2) 262M +
    Iron Man:
    1) 567M
    *****
    Am I missing something?…

  49. IOIOIOI says:

    A Fantasy movie involves magic and the sort. While a Comic Book movie involves mostly awesome. HUZZAH!
    Zealotry is not the word. It’s a simple point that has to be made. It’s the best of an entire GENRE and the best film to come out this year. The year has a long way to go, but it’s a great film. Denying it’s greatness because you have a fucking bone to pick with geeks and your entire attitude towards geek culture, is simply a rather large dick move.
    Nevertheless, Fantasy films and Comic Book films are two different genres. Those the reason they are put up against one another, when clearly one of them has had a lasting impact the other has not.

  50. Rob says:

    Whatever. I’m gonna go see Brideshead Revisited.

  51. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: the Oscars argument is still bullshit. You know it’s bullshit, and I will FIGHT YOU ALL DAY to make you state it’s bullshit. Seriously, those films are nothing special. They are not Kangaroo Jack bad or anything, but they really have not stood the test of time.
    You are also putting in only 3 big FANTASY FLICK FRANCHIES against only 3 COMIC BOOK FRANCIES. Ut-uh uh… it do not work that way. Why dont you throw in the Seeker, Eragon, and all of the other failed FANTASY FLICKS. While I throw in the rest of the Marvel catalog, Returns, Hellboy, V for Vendetta, the X-MEN FILMS, and so on.
    Do not fucking play with me, Chappy. It only makes you look bad :D!

  52. mutinyco says:

    IO, you’re making yourself look bad.
    I don’t like Rings. I don’t like fantasy. I don’t like comics.
    But this was the decade of fantasy. It just was.

  53. IOIOIOI says:

    Rob: I would have gone and seen it. If it were playing in my area. Who does not love some great British melodrama?
    I also need to check out Reprise before it up and vanishes. Heck, the freakin Wackness has not even shown up yet, but I am really not looking forward to reliving 1994. Of course there’s some dude who goes on and on about Thirlby “OWNING”. So I might check it out because of him alone.

  54. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: THE X-MEN FILMS pretty much blow-up your entire point. Did you forget about those 3 high grossing and 2 out of three of them being incredibly popular?
    Did you also forget that Daredevil, Elektra, and even freakin Ghost Rider are solid earners? While almost every fantasy film not titled HARRY POTTER or LOTR has failed this decade? This does include Narnia because Caspian blew up real good.
    So you do not like any of these genres, but you think that makes your point more valid? Bullshit. It only goes to show that you most likely have shitty and limited taste in film. Good for you.
    This does not change the fact that COMIC BOOK MOVIES have DRIVEN THE BOX OFFICE OF THIS DECADE. That’s a fact. Rather you want to accept it or not.

  55. mutinyco says:

    IO, the highest grossing X-Men was $455M.
    My point stands. The highest grossing X-Men still only made half of Harry Potter #5.
    Fantasy, IO. Fantasy.

  56. Hallick says:

    “A Fantasy movie involves magic and the sort. While a Comic Book movie involves mostly awesome. HUZZAH!”
    So, when it came down to doing the best you could do or instead typing something everybody’s 9 year old nephew would find a little childish and self-defeating, you went with the latter? Was it gladly? Have you suddenly become a Will Ferrell character? If this were the first thing I’d ever read that you’d written, I’d have to double check the URL and make sure that The Hot Blog wasn’t bought and turned into a Wiggles message board.
    You’re better than this IOIOIOI. Right?

  57. Noah says:

    Um, is it possible – just possible – that both comic book films and fantasy films have been incredibly successful at the box office lately?

  58. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: you have got to be kidding me. You have to be out to fucking lunch to think that 9 FANTASY films have outgrossed more than CLOSE TO 20 COMIC BOOK FILMS.
    Again, your argument falls apart, when it’s not a BRAND NAME like Potter and LOTR. Hell, if the decade is nothing but fantasy. Please explain why in the DECADE of fantasy why PRINCE CASPIAN failed? Oh yeah, I forgot, it was the Summer of great Comic Book films, and no one gave a shit about fantasy.
    So, again, you have no argument. You have an opinion, that the facts prove wrong. Heck, if you think about it, the X-MEN really started the COMIC BOOK GENRE rolling in this decade way back in 2000. Which really makes this the decade of COMIC BOOK MOVIES.

  59. IOIOIOI says:

    Hallick: it’s called being SILLY. This is how I roll. If you have a problem with it. You have to realize that some people do not have sticks in their asses, and like to joke about things.
    Noah: I would buy that point if there were another fantasy film franchise out there besides those three. There simply is not. All of those films have failed and failed miserably. While comic-book films based around little known characters and little known stories, have MADE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS COMBINED AT THE BOX-OFFICE.
    Mutiny is simply putting forth a supisition that facts rip apart. He also is acting as if he’s right, when he’s more wrong than Poland during Academy time.

  60. mutinyco says:

    IO, I keep offering you actual statistics.
    You keep offering incoherent ramblings.
    Even if you want to add up the smaller films of each genre (Compass did $364M, Eragon did $245M) and compare…
    No comic book movie will ever earn 11 Oscars including Best Picture.
    You don’t have an argument. Fantasy.

  61. Noah says:

    Oy vey. If I cared enough about this argument, I’d look up some facts and figures, but this is idiotic. Fantasy films vs. comic book films? Comic book films are fantasies. Who cares which films were more successful at the box office? Does that make one genre better than the other? Does it make you feel better to know that your tastes are unbelievably ordinary, falling in line with the masses?

  62. mutinyco says:

    Noah, I don’t like either genre. I’m simply basing my case on statistics. I’m not terribly emotionally involved in this.

  63. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: who gives a shit about Oscars? Seriously though, if the Academy is to be taken seriously this year. They will have to nominate the hell out of the Dark Knight. Unless they are filled with people like you, who seem to think that Aragorn and whiny Hobbits mean more in the grand scheme of things than a tale of the Bat and the Freak battling for the soul of a city.
    So you have now been proven wrong about the box office, and want to focus on the fucking Oscars? You mean those fine folks who like to act as if Richard Burton was not one of the greatest actors who ever lived, failed to give the Beatles an Oscar, and gave an Oscar to MEMPHIS’ OWN THREE SIX MAFIA before Scorcese are a basis for an argument? Million Dollar FUCKING BABY, sir. That’s all I am stating.
    Again… Hellboy has had two sequels in this decade. Hellboy. A movie about the son of the devil, raised by an Englishman, and who routinely saves the world. While Golden Compass was the biggest quagmire of this decade outside of Eddie Murphy’s self-destruction, and every other NON-POTTER/LOTR fantasy movie failed miserably.
    THUS NEGATING YOUR ENTIRE FUCKING POINT!

  64. Hallick says:

    “Noah: I would buy that point if there were another fantasy film franchise out there besides those three. There simply is not.”
    The Pirate of the Carribean franchise. Sold!
    “Hallick: it’s called being SILLY. This is how I roll. If you have a problem with it. You have to realize that some people do not have sticks in their asses, and like to joke about things.”
    Okay. But if you go back and read all of the posts you’ve put up today, I think you’ll find a Louisville Slugger with the inscription “fantasy sucks – comic books rule!” on it somewhere in their cumulative colon.

  65. mutinyco says:

    IO, you can continue masturbating in front of the mirror all you want.
    You lost this argument a while ago without making a single statistical point.
    Emotion is one thing. Facts are another.

  66. IOIOIOI says:

    Noah: you do not know my fucking taste. Mr. ARTYS BROOKLYN BOY trying to start some smack really is annoying, when you still read like a fucking cypher of a human being. Where’s your EMOTION BOY! WHERE IS IT?
    Seriously, this is not about anything other than another asshole on this blog making a bullshit argument. If he’s not too much emotionally involved in it. He should stop because he’s wrong. He’s totally and utterly fucking wrong.

  67. Hallick says:

    “No comic book movie will ever earn 11 Oscars including Best Picture.”
    Why? When the day comes, in some year in the future, is it going to earn 12 instead?

  68. The Lord Of The Rings films are better than The Dark Knight… Not to knock either/or, but the first and third films have several incredibly moving moments (the Bilbo/Frodo/Gandolf stuff in the first act of Fellowship, the whole wrap-up of Return Of The King) that The Dark Knight doesn’t even try to match. That I prefer Fellowship Of The Ring doesn’t mean my appreciation for The Dark Knight rises or falls in relation.
    And yes, while The Dark Knight was technically a better film with far more replay value, I was far more moved by the last fifteen minutes of Hancock (the coda was uncommonly touching). Heck, to be fair, Speed Racer works as a more emotionally compelling adventure film. It was also as subtle about character as The Dark Knight was monloguingly on-the-nose. Granted, emotional oomph isn’t a necessary component, but all things being equal, having that oomph puts you ahead of a movie that doesn’t.
    Frankly, while I really, really liked The Dark Knight (the second viewing helped me fill in plot holes and thus appreciate it even more), that’s partially because I am a hardcore Batman nut and I enjoyed how The Joker and Jim Gordon were treated. Truth be told, especially in the first 75 minutes, unless you’re a junkie for tough-guy crime drama and/or you get a nerd boner from watching Jim Gordon and Harvey Dent argue with with each other on a rooftop, there’s not much for the non-geek aside from Joker’s occasional appearances. Yes, it’s well-acted and reasonably intelligent crime drama, but that’s not going to merit a repeat viewing from non-nerds (again, I count myself as a Batman nerd).
    Not to bring up my wife again, but she likes the movies but isn’t a geek or a film buff, thus she’s a good example of a ‘normal moviegoer’. So, while she could certainly admire the craft, the tension building, and the acting, it didn’t do much for her because she wasn’t hardwired to get off on seeing Batman and his cast interact in a serious, faithful fashion.
    Point being, not liking The Dark Knight doesn’t make you a bad guy, and giving it a B or B+ doesn’t make you a hater. Relax, it’s a damn good movie and the masses are responding. But just like religion, someone else not loving it doesn’t lessen your appreciation.

  69. Noah says:

    If you were referring to me, I don’t live in Brooklyn. And I think everybody here is aware of your taste when you talk about blowing your load over every comic book movie that comes along.

  70. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: what facts? You made up a ridiculous supisition that included Oscars and box-office. You put up only three FANTASY FRANCHISES up against only three COMIC BOOK FRANCHISES, and ignored all of the FANTASY FRANCHISE STARTERS that have failed.
    If it were all about fucking fantasy this decade. Please explain to me why so many of these fantasy films have failed miserably at the box office? If it’s all about fantasy. Why is it Prince Caspian is such a forgettable affair?
    Seriously mutiny, you are nothing more than some arrogant and pompus fuck. Who stepped to me with some bullshit, and I swat the fuck out of you. You got what you deserved. So please go back into your hole with your piddly facts.
    Hallick: The LOTR films are good films. I love the Potter films and enjoyed the first Narnia. Hell, if I did not love fantasy films so much, I doubt that I would have spent so many years enjoying Dragonslayer. Seriously, it’s not the films, but this cunts points that have gotten that bat.

  71. Hallick says:

    “The Pirate of the Carribean franchise. Sold!”
    Better known as the PIRATES WITH A FUCKING ‘S’ IN IT YOU FUCKING HALF-COCKED MORON of the Carribean franchise. Resold! With extra S! (and mannnnnn, I see that last sentence coming back to haunt me, but I’m leaving it in anyway)

  72. mutinyco says:

    IO, one last time.
    You lost.
    Now go away you miserable troll cunt.

  73. IOIOIOI says:

    Scotty posted: “Point being, not liking The Dark Knight doesn’t make you a bad guy,”
    Now it does.
    “and giving it a B or B+ doesn’t make you a hater.”
    If you do it the way Poland does it. You are a serious hater.
    “Relax, it’s a damn good movie and the masses are responding. But just like religion, someone else not loving it doesn’t lessen your appreciation.”
    If they are being dicky about it, then it just pisses me off. My friend — who could give a shit about comic book films — was left with only one word after seeing this film; “WOW.” So you and your wife are in agreement. Good for you. My peeps love it and anyone who would dare talk any smack about it. Well… they have a poppycockin coming!
    David Poland on saltpeter posted; “If you were referring to me, I don’t live in Brooklyn. And I think everybody here is aware of your taste when you talk about blowing your load over every comic book movie that comes along.”
    I love FILM. Unlike you, it means a lot to me, and I am willing to get all EMOTIONAL ABOUT IT.
    So please refrain from even coming close to imagining what I love or what I like, asshole. If you knew me, then you could make that statement, asshole. Since you do not know me like I do not know you, but I still think this statement alone makes you read like an asshole.

  74. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: I got you to use “trolling cunt”. I win. I was also here on DAY ONE. When did you show up? Hit the bricks kid. You just do not have it to hang here anymore.

  75. mutinyco says:

    Dave, honestly, I think it’s about time you banned your first guest. Seriously. At least LexG was funny.
    IO basically spends his time saying ‘fuck you’ to everybody on the board, including you.
    He has nothing positive to add.

  76. IOIOIOI says:

    Oh yeah, oddly enough, DPOSP aka Noah may have been right according to Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fantasy_films:2000s . So I still win for the “trolling cunt” comment, but Noah wins on style points and baton twirling.

  77. IOIOIOI says:

    Mutiny: what positive do you have to add? You lose an argument, curse me out, and I curse out everyone?
    If anyone should be banned. It should be people like you that should hit the bricks, because you lack the ability to admit when you are wrong, and only want to fight.
    If you want to fight. You get the fight. If you want to be cool. Everything is cool.
    How many times do I have to re-iterate to assholes like you, that I am sick of fighting? 15 times? 69 times? 1596786765 times? Yet you and Leah try to start some shit. It’s pathetic.
    So please keep on wanting me to be banned, but realize I keep the OFF-BOARD PEOPLE happy. You know, those people who have to read your lame ass post, and like that I add the colour to your gray ass crap.

  78. Hallick says:

    “Hallick: The LOTR films are good films. I love the Potter films and enjoyed the first Narnia. Hell, if I did not love fantasy films so much, I doubt that I would have spent so many years enjoying Dragonslayer. Seriously, it’s not the films, but this cunts points that have gotten that bat.”
    Are you sure? It’s not coming off that way:
    “Let’s ignore how important BATMAN STILL IS and respond to this bullshit… FANTASY FILM? You mean those three films that look worse as the years go by, and those three films mostly about walking? Please.”
    And what about this one?:
    “Those LOTR films are all but forgotten by most folks. Their Oscars for a FX remain the biggest laughing stock of this decade outside of the Golden Compass FX Oscar, and let’s just giggle about the Academy giving the best picture to a film with 15 endings.
    The LOTR films couldn’t carry TDK or BEGINS jock.”
    You could argue this one, but I don’t read much love into it:
    “Especially your Oscar argument about Fantasy films because THOSE FILMS ARE OVERRATED. Easily the most over-lavished and over-hyped flicks to come out of Hollywood in years.”
    and finally:
    “Seriously, those films are nothing special. They are not Kangaroo Jack bad or anything, but they really have not stood the test of time.”
    If you didn’t mean any harm to the films themselves, they certainly became collateral damage in your pursuit of mutinyco.

  79. scooterzz says:

    the ‘i hate io’ party may be the longest running (and most attended) festival in hot blog history….
    that said, ‘you’ve just been poppycocked’ is my new fave phrase…….

  80. IOIOIOI says:

    Oh yeah… on behalf of Iraq war vet and generally awesome guy Sgt. Keith Manning. This is me saying; “DONE!” On this thread.

  81. IOIOIOI says:

    Hallick: It’s a “salt the earth” strategy, that my Luna Lovegood-loving heart will yell at me about later.
    Scoot: it worked for Nixon, and I do a wicked NIXON impression! So… hooah… and I am glad I made you laugh.

  82. scooterzz says:

    at you, io…never with you…please don’t make that mistake….

  83. Not to get snippy, but if you read my comment that you’d know that my wife and I disagreed. I really liked the movie, while she didn’t care much for it. I was trying to explain in a reasonable and thoughtful fashion why different people would have different reactions. Obviously it’s stupid of me to even respond to the ramblings of such a random free-associating nutcase, but I felt that DP and Movieman deserved defending, even if I disagreed with them.
    Pity that film conversation has often sunk tot he level of so much political discourse.

  84. Hallick says:

    “Hallick: It’s a “salt the earth” strategy, that my Luna Lovegood-loving heart will yell at me about later.”
    Good. Then maybe next time you can write more from the heart and less from the arse since tonight, compared to LexG, you’re the guy wearin’ hockey pants.

  85. Noah says:

    The interesting thing is that a lot of the folks here seem genuinely interested in having spirited discussions and it’s fascinating that whenever IO is involved, it’s never a discussion or even an argument but a fight. I think sometimes you’ve got good ideas and interesting things to say, IO, but it’s frustrating to have discussions with you because it often devolves into a dick measuring contest. I love film too, but we can respectively disagree and state our cases whilst still being passionate. Calling someone an asshole for having a different opinion doesn’t make you more passionate.
    I know this all just feeding the troll as they say, so I’ll refrain in the future. But I know that I, personally, don’t post here as much because when I want to talk about my opinions, I don’t want to be called a moron just because I liked (but didn’t love) The Dark Knight.

  86. scooterzz says:

    well, hell….maybe ‘you’re the guy wearing hockey pants’ is my new fave phrase…i need to start writing shit down….

  87. mutinyco says:

    Noah, the point is, and especially as you work for MCN, you shouldn’t feel the need to refrain from your opinions on this board.
    IO needs to go. That was the point of my feeding the troll.

  88. yancyskancy says:

    Still haven’t seen TDK. Waiting for a fresh look at “Begins,” which I didn’t care for the first time around. So I can’t really “play” in this thread.
    So I’ve just stopped by to note, IOIOIOI, that the Beatles DID win an Oscar, for “Let It Be.”

  89. IOIOIOI says:

    Mendelson: you’ve got to be kidding me with your response.
    Scoot: rude as always and written in the style of a hyperactive 13 year-old Japanese girl.
    Mutiny: do you even know what trolling is? Trolling is when someone — whose not a regular like you — goes around starting a fight. You were trolling tonight by starting an argument about something you do not even like. An argument, that should be note, we were both wrong thanks to the Wiki people getting over our semantics. So, you, were the one trolling.
    Noah: it has to do with respect. I am attacked around here all the damn time. If you notice. I have been acting cool until troll boy posted his poppycock. Also, let’s not forget leah, who gets a pass for being a kiwi and a mom! WOO hoo.
    So if you are going to disrespect me. I will show you no respect and everything will be a fight. Fighting is something that people on the HOT BLOG LOVE because it’s a BLOG RAN BY DAVID FREAKIN POLAND!
    Have any of you checked out the Luke post? Poland is throwing down in there in ways that only he can. He’s fighting, cursing, and doing everything you people seem to attack me about on a daily basis.
    Sure. He’s the man, but he’s fighting. You people had vicious fights without me over the two years that I did not post here. How do I know? I would occasionally stop by and read them, but I am the problem? Lex is the problem? Poppyfuckingcock.
    The problem is this: us, It’s all of us because it’s not only I who post in a disrespectful manner. If you motherfuckers ever posted in such a fashion that did not read condescending. Everyone would be fine, but you simply have to be dicks. You simply have to be assholes to people, when it’s not called for in the slightest.
    This is not to state that I am not guilty to overreacting on occasion, but I am only responding to people who seemingly treat a fellow poster as if they were shit on the bottom of their shoe. Too bad for fucking you then, that I can throw down in ways only years of dealing with bitchy geeks and fangirls can achieve.
    So… you want to be cool… then stop treating each other like assholes. This goes for everyone. Those with their heads inside and outside of their asses.

  90. LexG says:

    RISE UP, IO.
    MAN CREATES HIS OWN DESTINY. BE A FUCKING KING.

  91. “Unless they are filled with people like you, who seem to think that Aragorn and whiny Hobbits mean more in the grand scheme of things than a tale of the Bat and the Freak battling for the soul of a city.”
    IO, I’d hazard a bet and say that they mean about the same. LOTR and Batman are both made up stories and really have absolutely no stand in the “grand scheme of things”. These movies ain’t gonna change anybody’s life, ya know. And you’re even more insane than I already thought if you think the LOTR movies have been “all but forgotten by most folks”. Maybe you should stop hanging around the places that made you The X-Files: I Want to Believe was going to be a big huge smash and actually return to the real world where Lord of the Rings remains a monumental achievement in filmmaking.

  92. LexG says:

    LOTR is for collectivist/friend-heavy Beatles people, and BATMAN is for Elvis/awesome loner people.

  93. Oh, and was “poppycock” on your word of the day calender or something? And nice to see your throwing comments like “in the style of a hyperactive 13 year-old Japanese girl” into your usual repertoire of calling people fat, ugly and old.

  94. Such an insightful observation, Lex.

  95. LexG says:

    KCamel, always pissy and desperate to be heard.
    Seriously, dude, ONE day, no phones, no friends, no music, no blogs. What do you do with yourself?

  96. I don’t know why you’re so fascinated with what I do with my downtime, but one of the reasons I get so annoyed at you is because this is my downtime and I hate spending it having to deal with this crap.
    BTW, One of my jobs is as a music critic so listening to music is sort of a necessary part. If I don’t listen to music I don’t get paid.

  97. Jeremy King says:

    So…IO makes a spirited case for the enduring popularity of Comic Book movies over Fantasy Movies…Mutiny disagrees, and presents what she/he felt were irrefutable facts. IO counterargues. Mutiny spends the next 4 posts saying “I win, I have facts, I win. I won’t feed the troll. Oh yea, I win. Plus, I don’t care anyway I’m so emotionally uninvolved that I’ll post 40 times about it.” IO keeps arguing. Mutiny calls him a “cunt”.
    Sorry, but IO is way more entertaining (and just SLIGHTLY less smug)…I’d say the winner is IO.

  98. scooterzz says:

    jeremy — and, i’d say, you would be wrong…

  99. swordandpen says:

    Anyone know of a movie blog where the commenters actually talk about movies and where every thread isn’t hijacked by those craving the attention few people give them outside of the internet?

  100. not nathan arizona says:

    I dont know who “won” this thread, but I can safely say that by reading down to here, I am the real loser.

  101. The Pope says:

    Just saw TDK and wish to second what David Poland said about mentioning it in the same breath as The Godfather I and/or II. David said it is “inane.” I would add an “s” to that. It is “insane.” TDK is very, very entertaining. Crammed with great sequences… but what Coppola was working in another part of town. Don’t get me wrong, Nolan has twice delivered a first rate comic-book action-adventure movie (TDK is probably the best) to date). Coppola twice delivered first rate gangster poctures (G2 is probably the best to date). They are the best of their kind… but saying it is like G2… or even Mann’s Heat… well, that’s like comparing Lawrence of Arabia to Star Wars.

  102. The Pope says:

    Sorry for all the typos.

  103. Pope, I think it’s gotten to the point where there’s absolutely no point to say The Dark Knight is anything other than the greatest movie of all time. No matter how much praise you throw at it you’re gonna be labeled a hater because – like Scully in season one of The X-Files – you don’t truly believe.
    I personally LOVE this piece at a blog called Electronic Cerebrectomy
    http://samuraifrog.blogspot.com/2008/07/throwdown-725.html
    “Fanboys are so dick-brained these days that they

  104. doug r says:

    Went to see the 12:00 noon IMAX showing of Dark Knight yesterday. When I got to the theater at 11:25, the doors were already unlocked and a line was forming at the IMAX auditorium. The electronic marquee bottom banner stated that IMAX evening shows were sold out already-this at a place that wasn’t supposed to officially open until 11:30!
    IMAX adds some to the presentation-all the helicopter shot overhead sequences and most of the big set pieces are shot in IMAX. The IMAX sequences are easier to follow and really draw you in on the big screen. Something about no grain filling your field of view just draws you right in…

  105. chris says:

    It used to actually be fun and intriguing to read these threads.
    Bummer.

  106. martin says:

    There’s nothing wrong with forum moderation. MCN Blog used to be a good place for movie discussion, but no more. If Dave likes his forum to be a place of 3-5 idiots arguing and yelling at each other for 100 posts then I guess this is working out well. But between the caps-lock idiots and trolling this has become a very weak place for actual film discussion.

  107. Tofu says:

    $75 million second weekend. TDK takes the second weekend record. With the Mummy coming next weekend, it’ll have to fight like hell to challenge the third weekend record.

  108. Chucky in Jersey says:

    To blackcloud: Warner Bros. will release the “Clone Wars” movie because Cartoon Network (corporate cousin) will air the TV series.

  109. Blackcloud says:

    Chucky, I know, but apparently Fox was offered the series and passed. There was an article in NYT a few weeks ago which mentioned that. I don’t recall the exact details. I still think it’ll be weird seeing a Star Wars flick without the Fanfare.

  110. Agreed Blackcloud… part of the ‘buzz’ of the prequels was hearing the Fox fanfare as we waited for the opening blare of the Star Wars theme and the next chapter to begin. I’ll probably have to hum it to myself for shits n’ giggles.

  111. Cadavra says:

    All of this childisgh arguing and fighting and debating will become moot very soon when THE LOST SKELETON RETURNS AGAIN opens.
    The Skeleton OWNS. Believe it.

  112. Blackcloud says:

    I’ll be honest, Scott, and this probably shows how hopelessly immature I am, but whenever I see a Fox movie in the theater, I am sorely tempted to shout, “Yeah, Star Wars!” when the Fox logo hits the screen and the Fanfare starts playing. Star Wars without the Fanfare is almost unthinkable.

  113. the keoki says:

    wow! I feel dumber for skimming through all of that. Thank you IO and Mutiny. i think the feeling that TDK is “epic” is appropriate. but lets have a little perspective and see how it ages before giving it all these props. i loved the damn thing but it’s not Goodfellas or The Godfather II. It’s a damn good movie, when did that cease to be enough. Where’s Anton Ego when we need him?

  114. God I love Ego’s climactic speech in Ratatouille. It’s ironic that a movie that has a critic as a quasi-villain ends with said villain giving a powerful speech that ennobles criticism, unlike this current thread. Thank you Chucky and Blackcloud for rescuing us by changing the subject.

  115. Blackcloud says:

    I’ll talk Star Wars any time.

  116. frankbooth says:

    Yeah, I also feel like a complete loser for having read this far. What the fuck is wrong with me? I feel as if I just spent hours looking at porn or watching an American Idol marathon. I’d literally have been better off sleeping.
    Doug r — I’ve seen the film once in IMAX and once in 35mm, and difference is astounding. In a regular theater the film looked murky and even blurry at times. IMAX has totally spoiled me.
    I want to see an entire feature shot in this format. Maybe if Nolan sticks around for part 3…

  117. The Big Perm says:

    “Anyone know of a movie blog where the commenters actually talk about movies and where every thread isn’t hijacked by those craving the attention few people give them outside of the internet?”
    Fuck no, baby!

  118. Crow T Robot says:

    The Dark Knight is certainly provoking a religious-like response in the hearts and souls of even the more casual “drugstore” geeks (a pal of mine hasn’t talked to me for a week after I dismissed it). The film takes the general goofiness of superhero fiction and distills it into dark nasty realism. In doing so, it gives the Geek Movement what they think is a little ammo against those (ahem) who scoff at them as being in at least some state of arrested development.
    But now! The believers can point to Nolan’s gritty adult-hearted thriller and say, “Hey, this ain’t no Doctor Octopus! This ain’t spandex and CGI! No bro, THAT IS REALITY!”
    So spiritually TDK is an important step in the geek journey. It validates their immaturity like no film of its type has before. Big weekends weren’t enough. They needed to go legit. They need 60-year-olds. They need New York critics. And this one looks to be the key. It finds the geek’s inner nut job (the disconnected lead character, with his gadgets and costumes and awkwardness with chicks) and wants us to feel it. Deeply. Realistically. Painfully.
    Which, in my mind, makes the film more comparable to Taxi Driver than The Godfather.
    This fervor is fascinating.

Quote Unquotesee all »

It shows how out of it I was in trying to be in it, acknowledging that I was out of it to myself, and then thinking, “Okay, how do I stop being out of it? Well, I get some legitimate illogical narrative ideas” — some novel, you know?

So I decided on three writers that I might be able to option their material and get some producer, or myself as producer, and then get some writer to do a screenplay on it, and maybe make a movie.

And so the three projects were “Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep,” “Naked Lunch” and a collection of Bukowski. Which, in 1975, forget it — I mean, that was nuts. Hollywood would not touch any of that, but I was looking for something commercial, and I thought that all of these things were coming.

There would be no Blade Runner if there was no Ray Bradbury. I couldn’t find Philip K. Dick. His agent didn’t even know where he was. And so I gave up.

I was walking down the street and I ran into Bradbury — he directed a play that I was going to do as an actor, so we know each other, but he yelled “hi” — and I’d forgot who he was.

So at my girlfriend Barbara Hershey’s urging — I was with her at that moment — she said, “Talk to him! That guy really wants to talk to you,” and I said “No, fuck him,” and keep walking.

But then I did, and then I realized who it was, and I thought, “Wait, he’s in that realm, maybe he knows Philip K. Dick.” I said, “You know a guy named—” “Yeah, sure — you want his phone number?”

My friend paid my rent for a year while I wrote, because it turned out we couldn’t get a writer. My friends kept on me about, well, if you can’t get a writer, then you write.”
~ Hampton Fancher

“That was the most disappointing thing to me in how this thing was played. Is that I’m on the phone with you now, after all that’s been said, and the fundamental distinction between what James is dealing with in these other cases is not actually brought to the fore. The fundamental difference is that James Franco didn’t seek to use his position to have sex with anyone. There’s not a case of that. He wasn’t using his position or status to try to solicit a sexual favor from anyone. If he had — if that were what the accusation involved — the show would not have gone on. We would have folded up shop and we would have not completed the show. Because then it would have been the same as Harvey Weinstein, or Les Moonves, or any of these cases that are fundamental to this new paradigm. Did you not notice that? Why did you not notice that? Is that not something notable to say, journalistically? Because nobody could find the voice to say it. I’m not just being rhetorical. Why is it that you and the other critics, none of you could find the voice to say, “You know, it’s not this, it’s that”? Because — let me go on and speak further to this. If you go back to the L.A. Times piece, that’s what it lacked. That’s what they were not able to deliver. The one example in the five that involved an issue of a sexual act was between James and a woman he was dating, who he was not working with. There was no professional dynamic in any capacity.

~ David Simon