It shows how out of it I was in trying to be in it, acknowledging that I was out of it to myself, and then thinking, “Okay, how do I stop being out of it? Well, I get some legitimate illogical narrative ideas” — some novel, you know?
So I decided on three writers that I might be able to option their material and get some producer, or myself as producer, and then get some writer to do a screenplay on it, and maybe make a movie.
And so the three projects were “Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep,” “Naked Lunch” and a collection of Bukowski. Which, in 1975, forget it — I mean, that was nuts. Hollywood would not touch any of that, but I was looking for something commercial, and I thought that all of these things were coming.
There would be no Blade Runner if there was no Ray Bradbury. I couldn’t find Philip K. Dick. His agent didn’t even know where he was. And so I gave up.
I was walking down the street and I ran into Bradbury — he directed a play that I was going to do as an actor, so we know each other, but he yelled “hi” — and I’d forgot who he was.
So at my girlfriend Barbara Hershey’s urging — I was with her at that moment — she said, “Talk to him! That guy really wants to talk to you,” and I said “No, fuck him,” and keep walking.
But then I did, and then I realized who it was, and I thought, “Wait, he’s in that realm, maybe he knows Philip K. Dick.” I said, “You know a guy named—” “Yeah, sure — you want his phone number?”
My friend paid my rent for a year while I wrote, because it turned out we couldn’t get a writer. My friends kept on me about, well, if you can’t get a writer, then you write.”
~ Hampton Fancher
“That was the most disappointing thing to me in how this thing was played. Is that I’m on the phone with you now, after all that’s been said, and the fundamental distinction between what James is dealing with in these other cases is not actually brought to the fore. The fundamental difference is that James Franco didn’t seek to use his position to have sex with anyone. There’s not a case of that. He wasn’t using his position or status to try to solicit a sexual favor from anyone. If he had — if that were what the accusation involved — the show would not have gone on. We would have folded up shop and we would have not completed the show. Because then it would have been the same as Harvey Weinstein, or Les Moonves, or any of these cases that are fundamental to this new paradigm. Did you not notice that? Why did you not notice that? Is that not something notable to say, journalistically? Because nobody could find the voice to say it. I’m not just being rhetorical. Why is it that you and the other critics, none of you could find the voice to say, “You know, it’s not this, it’s that”? Because — let me go on and speak further to this. If you go back to the L.A. Times piece, that’s what it lacked. That’s what they were not able to deliver. The one example in the five that involved an issue of a sexual act was between James and a woman he was dating, who he was not working with. There was no professional dynamic in any capacity.
~ David Simon
Oh Poland, you’re SUCH a bitch!
Uh huh. Avatar is nothing more than an over-inflated faux behemoth. Once this record gets broken in a rather short time, you might be able to see the forest for the trees. Right now, you are seeing a lot of trees and not realizing where you are standing.
Uh huh. Avatar is nothing more than an over-inflated faux behemoth. Once this record gets broken in a rather short time, you might be able to see the forest for the trees. Right now, you are seeing a lot of trees and not realizing where you are standing.
Uh huh. Avatar is nothing more than an over-inflated faux behemoth. Once this record gets broken in a rather short time, you might be able to see the forest for the trees. Right now, you are seeing a lot of trees and not realizing where you are standing.
Uh huh. Avatar is nothing more than an over-inflated faux behemoth. Once this record gets broken in a rather short time, you might be able to see the forest for the trees. Right now, you are seeing a lot of trees and not realizing where you are standing.
Uh huh. Avatar is nothing more than an over-inflated faux behemoth. Once this record gets broken in a rather short time, you might be able to see the forest for the trees. Right now, you are seeing a lot of trees and not realizing where you are standing.
Is that IO? He’s right, he really is clever.
“or 3 times what Gone With The Wind grossed WORLDWIDE in it’s first run”
If you are going to be making that sort of an argument and putting emphasis on the fact that GWTW had multiple runs, wouldn’t it be only fair to acknowledge that the during that first run the wordwide population was a small fraction of what it is today, that it didn’t get to as many contries as the newer film did, and that, just maybe, Avatar, doesn’t have the same re-release potential?
In any case, yawn. You are partial and one sided about the whole thing, it’s not even funny. Also, there’s nothing funnier (or offensive depending on how you look at it), than an analyst writing the 50th column all trying to get you to understand what Avatar’s gross is actually means. We’ve all seen the numbers, honey. We know what they mean.
(So, ok, the person above me really doesn’t get it but give the rest of us a break, willya?)
The only thing that you are proving with this, is that you do care about older films grosses. Otherwise, you would have left these amazing out of this world grosses of Avatar alone and let them speak for themselves, oh two fucking months ago.
Or as David Mamet once wrote, “cue the dead horse”.
And by person above I meant the person, above that person.
Yeah, how dare a box office journalist comment on the biggest box office hit in over a decade, and possibly of all time.
How dare he.
Anyways, if Avatar makes it past 2.8 billion, than we’re looking at bigger ‘attendance’ figures than Titanic at that point. w00t.
If Avatar’s record is really so amazing, let us all wait and see what happens in the next year or two. If this record survives the 3D onslaught with all the new 3D screens opening up in the coming years, and all of those 3D releases, then maybe your crowing will mean something. Right now, you are just denying the obvious, but that’s who you are.
If Avatar’s record is really so amazing, let us all wait and see what happens in the next year or two. If this record survives the 3D onslaught with all the new 3D screens opening up in the coming years, and all of those 3D releases, then maybe your crowing will mean something. Right now, you are just denying the obvious, but that’s who you are.
If Avatar’s record is really so amazing, let us all wait and see what happens in the next year or two. If this record survives the 3D onslaught with all the new 3D screens opening up in the coming years, and all of those 3D releases, then maybe your crowing will mean something. Right now, you are just denying the obvious, but that’s who you are.
If Avatar’s record is really so amazing, let us all wait and see what happens in the next year or two. If this record survives the 3D onslaught with all the new 3D screens opening up in the coming years, and all of those 3D releases, then maybe your crowing will mean something. Right now, you are just denying the obvious, but that’s who you are.
If Avatar’s record is really so amazing, let us all wait and see what happens in the next year or two. If this record survives the 3D onslaught with all the new 3D screens opening up in the coming years, and all of those 3D releases, then maybe your crowing will mean something. Right now, you are just denying the obvious, but that’s who you are.
Tofu continues to not grasp mouth. He learned this from David Poland, the man Devin Farci calls; “that guy who looks like me if I stopped trying.”
Tofu continues to not grasp mouth. He learned this from David Poland, the man Devin Farci calls; “that guy who looks like me if I stopped trying.”
Tofu continues to not grasp mouth. He learned this from David Poland, the man Devin Farci calls; “that guy who looks like me if I stopped trying.”
Tofu continues to not grasp mouth. He learned this from David Poland, the man Devin Farci calls; “that guy who looks like me if I stopped trying.”
Tofu continues to not grasp mouth. He learned this from David Poland, the man Devin Farci calls; “that guy who looks like me if I stopped trying.”
that’s MATH not MOUTH but this blog lacks an edit function, hooray for silly typos! Booyah!
that’s MATH not MOUTH but this blog lacks an edit function, hooray for silly typos! Booyah!
that’s MATH not MOUTH but this blog lacks an edit function, hooray for silly typos! Booyah!
that’s MATH not MOUTH but this blog lacks an edit function, hooray for silly typos! Booyah!
that’s MATH not MOUTH but this blog lacks an edit function, hooray for silly typos! Booyah!
I don’t think any other 3D movie is going to be beating Avatar. None released so far has even come close.
IO, why aren’t you using your old name?
Biggie that’s old 3D movies. Every major tentpole film coming down the line will be 3D. Toy Story 3 should come close to breaking the domestic record and easily gross 2 billion domestic. Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows will be a two part film in 3D and Potter has always been very strong internationally, so the international record will fall and fall hard in 2010 or 2011.
Do you see what I am getting at here? Does anyone here want to get it? These records are going to start falling and falling hard and much like with baseball at this point after steroids, people like Poland are going to have to come to grips with this being a juiced ball era in box office. Once 3D dies off and we all know that it will, the movie that grosses a lot then will be considered the real all-time box office champ. That’s going to happen, bet on it, and stop acting as if price-gauging is not changing the validity of these box office numbers.
Biggie that’s old 3D movies. Every major tentpole film coming down the line will be 3D. Toy Story 3 should come close to breaking the domestic record and easily gross 2 billion domestic. Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows will be a two part film in 3D and Potter has always been very strong internationally, so the international record will fall and fall hard in 2010 or 2011.
Do you see what I am getting at here? Does anyone here want to get it? These records are going to start falling and falling hard and much like with baseball at this point after steroids, people like Poland are going to have to come to grips with this being a juiced ball era in box office. Once 3D dies off and we all know that it will, the movie that grosses a lot then will be considered the real all-time box office champ. That’s going to happen, bet on it, and stop acting as if price-gauging is not changing the validity of these box office numbers.
Biggie that’s old 3D movies. Every major tentpole film coming down the line will be 3D. Toy Story 3 should come close to breaking the domestic record and easily gross 2 billion domestic. Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows will be a two part film in 3D and Potter has always been very strong internationally, so the international record will fall and fall hard in 2010 or 2011.
Do you see what I am getting at here? Does anyone here want to get it? These records are going to start falling and falling hard and much like with baseball at this point after steroids, people like Poland are going to have to come to grips with this being a juiced ball era in box office. Once 3D dies off and we all know that it will, the movie that grosses a lot then will be considered the real all-time box office champ. That’s going to happen, bet on it, and stop acting as if price-gauging is not changing the validity of these box office numbers.
Biggie that’s old 3D movies. Every major tentpole film coming down the line will be 3D. Toy Story 3 should come close to breaking the domestic record and easily gross 2 billion domestic. Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows will be a two part film in 3D and Potter has always been very strong internationally, so the international record will fall and fall hard in 2010 or 2011.
Do you see what I am getting at here? Does anyone here want to get it? These records are going to start falling and falling hard and much like with baseball at this point after steroids, people like Poland are going to have to come to grips with this being a juiced ball era in box office. Once 3D dies off and we all know that it will, the movie that grosses a lot then will be considered the real all-time box office champ. That’s going to happen, bet on it, and stop acting as if price-gauging is not changing the validity of these box office numbers.
Biggie that’s old 3D movies. Every major tentpole film coming down the line will be 3D. Toy Story 3 should come close to breaking the domestic record and easily gross 2 billion domestic. Harry Potter and The Deathly Hallows will be a two part film in 3D and Potter has always been very strong internationally, so the international record will fall and fall hard in 2010 or 2011.
Do you see what I am getting at here? Does anyone here want to get it? These records are going to start falling and falling hard and much like with baseball at this point after steroids, people like Poland are going to have to come to grips with this being a juiced ball era in box office. Once 3D dies off and we all know that it will, the movie that grosses a lot then will be considered the real all-time box office champ. That’s going to happen, bet on it, and stop acting as if price-gauging is not changing the validity of these box office numbers.
Sometimes people on the internet say things so stupid you have to write them off permanently. Toy Story 3 is going to make 2 billion domestic? Jesus Christ.
It would be awesome if IOI would shut up permanently when his insane predictions don’t come true. Of course, that’s never stopped him before.
Uh…Life&Death, if you think these other 3D movies are going to be taking down Avatar’s box office with regularity, what makes you think it would die off? Don’t you think those two viewpoints don’t connect?
At any rate, I guess I was wrong about Life&Death being IO since he won’t cop to it…so you want to talk about IO while he’s not around? Hey L&D, don’t you think that guy’s a real chump?
perm, you should know better than to use reason and logic with io!
“Ladies and Gentlemen, I unveil to you the world’s tallest building.”
“Hang on a second, your building is only the tallest because you made out of wood. That one over there, the one I made, I made with mud. And if I had known how to use wood, I would have made the world’s tallest building. And let me point out, you’re measuring in metric, not imperial. And besides, just you wait til I start using stone. And then metal. I’m gonna be taller.”
Money is only as valuable as an economy makes it. Avatar is top of the pile. Can we please move on?
If there were ANY JUSTICE IN THE WORLD, “BROOKLYN’S FINEST” would kick Avatar’s blue ass to the curb.
(Obviously it’ll make all of seveteen bucks from my two matinee viewings.)
But LEGIT POINT: How come critics and film geeks don’t GET OFF HARDER on cops, coke, gangs, hip-hop, shotguns and urban grit? If I were BIG JIM CAMERON, I’d put all my money, energy and ambition into making some 3-hour Scarface/New Jack/Training Day/The Shield/Blow/Belly/American Gangster/Heat/Bad Boys II-type rap-scored, coked-up, gunfire-filled Tony Scott-Michael Mann hybrid gangsta flick. But geek filmmakers and MOST FILM CRITICS don’t groove on the power of shotgun violence, coke or rap. I can’t see (no offense) Poland or Wells or whoever jamming out grinning ear to ear over some disreputable, ultraviolent bass-thumping insane shit. Otherwise they would’ve actually SEEN one of the Crank or Transporter movies in a theater instead of NEVER because it’s “beneath them.”
Like, don’t you guys WANT TO BE COPS or WANT TO SHOOT GUNS? There’s NOTHING more exciting in all of cinema than COPS, GUNS, DRUGS and SEX.
AVATAR only has guns. And BLUE HIPPIES WHO SUCK. They NAVI could’ve been COKE DEALING dredlocked bad motherfuckers who could fight back and who bumped JAY-Z music and sold white women in human trafficking schemes or something. As they are, they’re just New Age pussies ripe for being picked off by GOOD GUY STEPHEN LANG.
And you’ll never EVER convince me that the critical hosannahs aren’t just from Good Hollywood Liberals who like pretending they give a shit about the environment, which NO ONE WITH A SCROTUM gives a fuck about.
You really CARE about the environment? THEN WHY HAVE KIDS if you REEEEEEEEEEEEEEALLY believe the world’s gonna fry in 10, 20, 50 years?
YOU DON’T BELIEVE IT FOR A SECOND.
IO/Life&Death/Whoever you are, if movies start grossing $2bil on a regular basis then won’t that confirm everything you hate and that’s that Avatar will have indeed changed movies? If movies start making $2bil on a regular basis then they won’t continue to be eye-bulging. If a movie overtakes Avatar then you can bet your arse it’ll be as equally a stunning feat as Avatar has been. And just because a movie overtakes Avatar, doesn’t make Avatar‘s numbers any less special, just like Avatar overtaking Titanic didn’t make the latter film’s numbers any less spectacular.
“Right now, you are just denying the obvious, but that’s who you are.”
Pot, kettle, etc. You’re a tool.
“YOU DON’T BELIEVE IT FOR A SECOND.”
Wow, I just had this conversation yesterday. People who “fear” man-made global warming remind me of Christians who fear death. Because if they were really 100% sure there was a heavenly paradise awaiting, wouldn’t they welcome cancer? Wouldn’t they be like, “Awesome! I have AIDS!”
Similarly, if you really thought the planet was doomed if we didn’t Do! Something! Right! Now!, wouldn’t you pretty much dedicate every waking hour to that mission?
Not really, since it’s always been humanity’s way to ignore problems…much like the cancer patient who skips going to treatments in order to finish school or something, and then dies. Or morbidly obese people who know that condition ain’t healthy but can’t stop eating Twinkies.
Nice faux-news style sophistic concern-trolling there Josh. Climate change is actually not a matter of “belief”. It’s a matter of established quantified observation, i.e. “science”. Check it out on wikipedia or something.
Isn’t it strange? Every blockbuster since Titanic has had BO enthusiasts wondering, with baited-breath, who will beat its gross. Lord of the Rings? No. Spider-man? No. The moment they get their first real contender (and eventual champ) they want to asterix the thing to death. Amazing.
Everyone keeps farting-on about adjusted vs. unadjusted grosses, but isn’t the real story not in the grosses but in the production budgets? E.T.’s adj gross is $1B DOM. It’s budget adj? Roughly $25M. Take that Avatar! (in unadj terms: Avatar will gross roughly 3x its budget DOM. E.T.? 40x) Avatar’s record will probably be broken in the next decade or two but you can bet-your-life the budget for that movie won’t be $25M (or $30M adj for 2020). Spielberg didn’t have a budget of $100M until A.I. ($100M) and has only had 3 others – Minority ($102), War ($132) and Indy4 ($185). [All from the dubious MOJO site but look pretty accurate to me] That shocks me, only 1 flick above $132M budget? (even if you inflate JP it still only cost $120M for an inflation adj $660M DOM gross – that probably won’t happen again either)
On a side note: HR says Toy Story merch is at $8B WW since bedut of number 1. My baby cousin just got a Buzz doll. Who doesn’t think Toy3D is a $1B WW certainty?
Josh, good to see you have those GOP backwards-ass anti-science talking points down flat. Go look at some NASA photos for actual evidence. Good Lord.
“How come critics and film geeks don’t GET OFF HARDER on cops, coke, gangs, hip-hop, shotguns and urban grit? ”
Cos they’re tired cliches run into the ground on TV and bad movies. 1993 called and wants its B-Boy back, Lex…
And Josh, since I know you’re concerned about Islamic terrorism, how can you eat steak, make love or spend time on a movie blog just knowing they’re out there waiting to destroy America?
The difference: There are people taking care of the Islamic terrorism problem on my behalf. But if you look at the current crop of politicians, nothing is actively being done to combat the oh-so-real, except for the past 15 years, and at other cyclical points throughout history, MAN-MADE global warming issue.
It’s just like a couple months ago when news broke about scientists fudging numbers. Instead of a wave of “thank God it might not be really happening,” all I heard from the left was wailing and gnashing over “hackers.” Talk about religious fundamentalism. You guys would rather be right about the issue, than be wrong and have a healthy planet.
Really fun thread, here – laughing out loud.
Lex, drug dealers and cop violence never really went out of style, though they did have their popularity peak in the ’80’s. American Gangster did pretty well, from what I remember, and that stuff still completely permeates TV, right now.
One thing about Avatar, though I’m sure you were kidding – come on, these blue folks who are flying green dragons dead-on into gunships, shooting bows and arrows right into the cockpits are hippies??? That’s pretty bad-ass, if you ask me.
Avatar’s records will NOT fall for several years and that’s precisely BECAUSE of its success – EVERY studio is now clamoring to retrofit movies to 3D and get those screens, but there just aren’t enough to go around to keep up with the expected pace of one 3D tentpole every month. Seriously, Dragon and Titans are one week apart, one of them is going to pay.
Avatar was a perfect storm of circumstances that is not likely to be replicated again – among other reasons, it was able to hold on to those 3D screens for two and a half months. And spare me the price-gauging talk – no film holds this well for this long if people really don’t dig it. And the premium has been WAY overstated – maybe $2 to $4 in most theaters, when the typical night show is costing at least $8 in most markets. And it NEVER played in close to 4,000 theaters, unlike pretty much every other major film of the past decade.
Toy Story WILL be huge and I can see $1 billion WW easy.
“You guys would rather be right about the issue, than be wrong and have a healthy planet.”
Be wrong? Our planet is not healthy. And you’re the one who denies reality — you get your science from Rush Limbaugh, Dennis Prager and Sarah Palin ad religous looney tunes. The onus is on you to prove that melting polar ice caps and shoreline devastation and dying pockets of oceanic life are just kinda happening. And that NASA is in the pockets of wacko eco-warriors.
In other words, you’d rather let the planet die than acknowledge that scientists around the world for decades know a li’l more than FOX. Or you.
“The onus is on you to prove that melting polar ice caps and shoreline devastation and dying pockets of oceanic life are just kinda happening.”
Really? The onus is on the people who don’t want to spend hundreds of billions of dollars on what could be an imaginary problem? The problem that, even if true, hasn’t actually been a problem for 15 years?
A few billion is a drop on the bucket considering all the wasteful spending your party engaged in keep our nation less safe. See War, Iraq. How much should taxpayers keep pumping out for that GOP masterplan to save us all? And you have actual proof of global warming as opposed to…lies.
The record will fall in four years with the release of Cameron’s ALIEN V. TERMINATOR.
“Our planet is not healthy.”
THE PLANET IS FINE. Do you REALLY BELIEVE that the planet is hurting from our contribution, measured in parts-per-million, of a naturally-occurring trace gas? Does it at all matter to the earth’s health if there’s a couple more or a couple less miles of polar ice? If the sea level is a couple inches higher or lower? If the global temperature goes up or down a degree? If there are no polar bears or ONLY polar bears?
Tell me, what is the “correct” temperature of the earth? What is the “appropriate” concentration of CO2?
Billions of years, temperatures and sea levels much higher and much lower than present levels. More ice, less ice. Meteor hits, massive sunspot activity, volcanic eruptions, ice ages. The earth is chugging along nicely.
As George Carlin stated, “The earth isn’t going anywhere. WE ARE.” Please stop framing the argument in terms of how the earth is doing. If you believe in catastrophic man-made global warming, then discuss it in terms of how it will affect our human population.
Gee, if the fish and animals are dying off, and our oceans are polluted and our oxygen is thinning …well, that launches a whole chain of events that affect our well-being. Crazy.
But tell me, when aerosol cans were banned because of the clear connection between their use and our thinning ozone, did you freak out?
Hey, here’s a story from FOX (so you know it’s far and balanced science):
Global warming would be substantially worse right now if not for an international agreement in the 1980s that banned the use of ozone-destroying chemicals, a new study finds.
Nations around the world signed the Montreal Protocol in 1987 to control the production and use of substances that deplete the ozone layer, which shields the Earth from harmful ultraviolet radiation.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,258092,00.html
Another Carlin, from the same bit I believe: “Maybe the Earth made us because it couldn’t figure out how to make plastic.”
Here’s the Carlin video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjmtSkl53h4
Its pretty great.
“Does it at all matter to the earth’s health if there’s a couple more or a couple less miles of polar ice? If the sea level is a couple inches higher or lower? If the global temperature goes up or down a degree? If there are no polar bears or ONLY polar bears?”
I know that no force on earth could correct your ignorance, since facts are already irrelevant. Of course the danger that scientists are discussing is not a matter of a couple of inches of sea-level. We’re talking about meters, and in the next 50 years. We’re talking about 5+ degrees, and considerably more in polar regions. Which means not a “couple miles” less of polar ice, but its wholesale liquidation. Since, again, facts don’t matter in these kinds of discussions, I’ll just observe that the organized power of the carbon-burning lobby is truly impressive, since whenever the topic comes up literally anywhere on the internet you can count on well trained dupes to appear and display their ignorance. Anyway I’d much rather read boring chuckleheads whining about Avatar. That at least has the potential to be amusing.
To bring the conversation back to Gone with the Wind, World wide grosses most assuredly mattered in 1939, otherwise Disney wouldn’t have gone nearly bankrupt in 39-41 when war erupted in Europe and crippled his revenue stream. He made most of his profits worldwide, and you can bet that was true of the other studios as well.
The effects for Disney were enough to force him to push through the low budget Dumbo, slash Bambi’s budget in half (cutting out 3/4 of the forest fire scene, including the death of Thumper scene) and thirty minutes from its run time (most of Bambi’s adult life was cut from the film) and basically suspend all features after Dumbo until Cinderella (this is why the Fun & Fancy Free, Melody Time, Three Caballeros and Saludos Amigos were basically ‘on-the-cheap’ packagings of shorts and non-feature story material). The loss of the European box office had massive repercussions for Disney (and he’d already lost the Asian box office due to Japan declaring war on China earlier in the thirties). Disney was saved by government stimulus and the propaganda machine gearing up in 1942, he made enough from those productions to limp his way through the post war era and return with the great animated films of the fifties, innovating much of the rules about television/merchandising, and opening Disneyland. International box office returns for Pinocchio, Fantasia, Dumbo, and Bambi helped him out a lot throughout the post war era.
Though it is true international box office returns have always been an insanely complicated business, often with interesting and baffling agreements in place about studios being required to spend most if not all of the revenues earned in a country in that country. For many decades studios simply did not really bother declaring earnings from international box office revenue streams simply for tax purposes and because the money generally stayed within the various international divisions of the studio.
so Gone with the Wind probably earned enormous returns internationally, probably it earned more in 1946-50 internationally than it did in 1939-41 ‘first run’ releases because most of the international markets were evaporating into nothing. But those earnings may have never left the country, and were instead plunged back into production budgets for other studio/producer projects within those nationalities.
But international box office was certainly a factor in 1939. WB lost their entire revenue stream from Germany and nazi-friendly territories in 1939 due to the release of Confessions of a Nazi Spy (most hollywood stars refused to be in the movie due to pressure from the highly respected American branch of the Nazi party at the time). Since the “political” speech of the movie Confessions of A Nazi Spy was specifically prohibited by the Prodcution Code, Congress accused WB of warmongering and agitating–that they were slandering the good people of the Nazi party in America–and formed a House of Unamerican Activities Committee to investigate WB’s (and the hollywood Jews) war-mongering activities . in any event, WBs actions had negative repercussions on the other major and minor Studios overseas’ business and box office returns because the nazis started banning all american movies. WB was sort of anathema to the hollywood business elite from 39-Pearl Harbor because they’d hamstrung the highly lucrative international returns.
if ignorance is bliss, josh and mystery must be two balls-out serene dudes.
the human industrial-caused excelerated warming of the planet is disastrous on so many levels. the impending rise of the sea level is one serious threat, esp. to many of civilisation’s major cities, which are also ports built at or near sea level, but probably the most immediate and grave concern is for the major prevailing ocean currents that serve as the regulating engines of the earth’s climate and as a major component in the formation of the planet’s prevailing weather systems.
the huge volumes of fresh water locked up in the polar ice caps – particularly antarctica – are melting into the ocean at an alarming rate. fresh water is lighter and less dense than saline water and floats at the top, thus weakening and eventually destroying existing surface currents. these vital prevailing currents are a major component in keeping the temperature of the planet moderate and in the formation of prevailing weather systems.
weakening of these vital currents has ALREADY occurred, altering the planet’s climate and weather, and if the polar caps continue to melt unabated the major ocean currents that help regulate earth’s climate will be destroyed and the our climate will change drastically, quite possibly resulting in another ice age, particularly in northern europe/n. america. this is not some pie-in-the-sky hippie theory, this is hard science backed up by reputable monitoring agencies.
but by all means just keep your fingers stuck in your ears singing ‘LAH LAH LAH’ very loudly to yourself to drown out the truth, flat-earthers and teabaggers! (you know what the twin horns of satan are? ignorance and apathy)
Look, I’m very liberal and do believe in clean energy and all that. But don’t stories like this make you question some of what has been reported as fact:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1250872/Climategate-U-turn-Astonishment-scientist-centre-global-warming-email-row-admits-data-organised.html
I don’t know. I reposted that link because nobody responded when Josh posted it. Instead, he was ignored and told to go look at the facts on Wikipedia!!
How the hell did this thread end up here?
I will say that given how badly we understand weather in general (even in the short-term our predictions are notoriously fickle) I’m not sure that pointing to any data and claiming it “proves” anything will ever be completely accurate.
However, I also think that given how rapidly humans are terraforming the planet it would be naive to think that our industrialization is having no impact. If given a choice between slowing GDP growth by a percent or two and potentially fubaring our ecosystem, I think I’d err on the side of caution.
Not to mention that “Going Green” is a fucking COTTAGE INDUSTRY that’s going to make a lot of people billionaires a trillion times over… it has a momentum is being pushed super-hard NOT out of the goodness of anyone’s hearts to preserve the poor caribou and the polar ice caps, but because this TOTAL FUCKING RUSE of “climate change” is a great opportunity to SELL PEOPLE ON SHIT THEY DON’T NEED.
Funny that a lot of lefties (see: Christian) who demanded to see the paper trail on everything Bush or Cheney ever did, always looking for some conspiracy about “fat cats getting rich!” and screaming about oil! and greed! at every turn have absolutely ZERO CYNICISM about a scam of this magnititude.
But by all means, let’s everybody get herpes from DISGUSTING, urine-reeking “waterless urinals” and drive our SODA CANS down to the dump like Skid Row Joe out of some stupid misplaced guilt for something WE HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH, and which won’t happen till ANY OF US are long gone, so who gives a shit?
Just for christian and his ilk, I make a goddamn point of throwing every single piece of paper, can and bottle right into the regular trash, and I leave my lights on ALL FUCKING DAY AND NIGHT.
YEP YEP. Fuck the planet. “So what, who cares.”
well yes, because one man has trouble keeping his office tidy and filing his paperwork obviously negates the entire concept of climate change – compiled by numerous scientific organizations all over the world for over many, many years – to smithereens! christ, did anyone actually READ that article? it says virtually nothing of relevance.
(and ftr, weather and climate are two different things. weather is a term used to define day-to-day short-term conditions; climate is the term used to describe long-term prevailing conditions, which is at the heart of the climate-change debate)
lex, your lame attempt at shit-stirring is a huge predictable bore and you just sound like an ignoramus twat of epic proportions rather than a rebel. you know what would really make you a rebel: becoming an environmentalist. be unpredictable FOR ONE IN YOUR LIFE
FOR ONCE IN YOUR LIFE! i meant, if i could write without boo-boos
Yeah, Lex, this just blows apart half a century of scientific research and evidence. But you didn’t read this “expose” too clearly as leah points out. But it sounds good on talk radio. Those rising sea levels won’t effect you at all.
“Just for christian and his ilk, I make a goddamn point of throwing every single piece of paper, can and bottle right into the regular trash, and I leave my lights on ALL FUCKING DAY AND NIGHT.”
Well, nobody said you were smart. You waste money on leaving lights on and whine that you can’t afford to date anybody?
You guys got insults, I got facts.
Like the Mighty Limbaugh stepping out that hospital with that shit-eating grin and balls of steel declaring “There’s absolutely nothing wrong” with the healthcare system, I can tell you with equally awesome balls of steel certitude that I don’t think for one single, solitary second there’s ANYTHING wrong with the planet.
And if there is? Doesn’t matter a damn to me, ’cause I WON’T BE HERE FOR IT.
Leah, the ONLY way I’d ever become an environmentalist is if HOT ACTRESSES talked about it. But even they don’t care.
I do donate money to animal causes and support animal rights, however, because a) Animals are better than people and b) a lot of hot chicks pose naked for PETA.
When you have all of the money that Limbaugh has then yes, there’s nothing wrong with the health system.
Frankly, christian and leah, your responses truly bother me as someone who is probably on your side on 90% of most issues.
“One man having trouble keeping his office tidy”!!! Really, that’s the response? Okay, but I know if Limbaugh or Beck or some other clown gave a dismissive response like that to the guy who was in charge of keeping the paperwork on WMDs in Iraq straight, you’d be all over him.
Like I said, I have no idea what is true, but always assumed the science was accurate. Stuff like a prominent scientist claiming he manipulated data makes me a least a little more skeptical.
“he denied he had cheated over the data or unfairly influenced the scientific process, and said he still believed recent temperature rises were predominantly man-made.
Asked about whether he lost track of data, Professor Jones said:
“Do you agree that from 1995 to the present there has been no statistically-significant global warming?
Yes, but only just. I also calculated the trend for the period 1995 to 2009. This trend (0.12C per decade) is positive, but not significant at the 95% significance level. The positive trend is quite close to the significance level. Achieving statistical significance in scientific terms is much more likely for longer periods, and much less likely for shorter periods.
That
Yes, that is the same as “no global warming since 1995”.
The null hypothesis is always that there is no impact – in any kind of scientific testing. There is insufficient evidence to reject the null hypothesis, therefore we accept it.
I know in layman’s terms it’s not the same thing, but in scientific terms yes it is.
my point is (and i did a crap job of making it earlier in a rush) that jones is just ONE scientist of many who has contributed to the science and drawn conclusions on climate change. he is one man and most certainly not the sole arbiter of the validity of climate change by any stretch of the imagination.
to link that one article re: jones’ problems with keeping track of his data as some some ‘proof’ that climate change doesn’t exist is absurd. that article also makes unwarranted leaps of logic and draws illogical conclusions about jones’ actions and comments. to note, i believe the ‘mail’ is a notoriously conservative publication (tho i might have that wrong because i get some of the english rags confused)
Jeez, you guys have been debating climate change on The Hot Blog?
PS: Lex is a terrible person.
Movielocke: I’m sure you’ve heard the story that Goebbels once gave Hitler a collection of Mickey Mouse cartoons as a Christmas present. Evidently, this really did happen — though I’m not sure if Disney made any money off the deal.
How can such a simple point be missed entirely?
Even assuming leahnz’ doomday scenario as an inevitability, it leaves the earth in what state? An ice age. Wait– like all the other ice ages the earth has experienced? An ice age would be the way the earth “remedies” what some claim is “ailing” it! Humanity joins the millions of other species that have come and gone. “Problem” solved!
And that was my point. The wails of “The earth has a fever!” or “The planet is not healthy” is idiocy. Those assertions require the knowledge of what the “correct” state of these things are. How much CO2 is the “right” amount? How much land is “supposed” to be above sea level? What is the earth-equivalent of 98.6? In the context of earth’s history, can these trends be considered “worse” FOR THE EARTH?
Bad for us? Perhaps. But that wasn’t my point.
Regardless of which side of the anthropomorphic global warming debate one falls on, the news that has been coming out in the last months must raise the eyebrows of the critical thinker, such as:
World may not be warming, say scientists
UN climate change panel based claims on student dissertation and magazine article
Anything that stabs at the heart of the IPCC (which includes elements of the Climategate scandal) needs to be noted.
The earth has a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell!
And Josh, I hope you know that Obama is looking out for you with the capture of a Taliban bigwig. Meanwhile, Cheney thinks Obama is ineffectual.
As for the Drudge theatrics that inspire these denials of global warming, here’s a good piece:
To those familiar with the science and the IPCC
‘my’ doomsday scenario? mystery, your one eye is showing.
all your ‘what is the correct sea level?’ hogwash is just a smokescreen. the reality is, HUMANS are changing the sea level rather than it occurring in the natural cycle and balance of nature. yes, we are destroying our own habitat and harming the planet with our industrial by-products, but yes, of course the planet will heal when we are long gone. so? isn’t the idea to stick around and live in peace and harmony with our beautiful little planet for as long as possible? no? or are you of the philosophy, “he who dies with the most toys wins” and if we destroy our species and a great many others along the way, well who gives a shit?
what is the point of humanity on planet earth, please enlighten me.
“Regardless of which side of the anthropomorphic global warming debate one falls on, the news that has been coming out in the last months must raise the eyebrows of the critical thinker, such as:”
that is PRICELESS!
the critical thinker needs to have a very careful look at the source of the ‘news’, the validity of the ‘news’ and the agenda behind publishing such ‘news’.
that first link doesn’t work, but given the relevance of the second link, i’m sceptical of any relevance of the first. the IPCC ‘scandal’ is a storm in a teacup. if you bother to do any additional research, you’ll find that yes, a very small amount of anecdotal data found its way into a report based on a large amount of perfectly valid peer-reviewed data. the ‘controversy’ has been jacked up by right-wing publications and UTTERLY DISMISSED by climate scientists as more right-wing petrochemical-lobby hogwash.
the sad fact is, the ‘naysayers’ will jump on any minuscule detail or flaw in the data in a pathetic attempt to debunk the reality of climate change in the face of overwhelming scientific evidence to the contrary that industrial-induced climate change exists.
i could provide a plethora of links to counter the sheer silliness of the links provided here so far that supposedly cast ‘doubt’ on the science and existence of industrial-caused climate change, but frankly i can’t be bothered. use your brain and do it yourself. or don’t. people with blinders on will not listen anyway.
(isn’t it odd how every scientific study/report that denies the reality of climate change has been funded by the petrochemical industry? and every ‘news’ publication that so eagerly jumps on the ‘doubt’ bandwagon is right-wing, willingly publishing misleading and inaccurate propaganda?)
‘critical thinkers’ should look at ALL the evidence, not just the cherry-picked items spoon fed to them by the like-minded to support their denial.
christian’s paragraph above covers the IPCC ‘scandal’ perfectly, UTTER HOGWASH. if anyone puts any stock into this non-existent “controversy”, then you need to seek psychotherapy to reverse brain-washing toot sweet
Sorry, made a coding mistake. The first link is:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article7026317.ece
My initial criticism was solely about how some frame the issue, nothing more. “Save the Planet” IS nonsense. As I stated, even if the worst case scenario climate alarmists have to offer came to pass, it wouldn’t be unprecedented. The polar ice caps have completely melted and reformed. Sea levels have been 100 feet higher than present levels. CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere have been much higher. Millions of species have gone extinct. So what, you ask? Right, it was just a quibble.
Truth is, I didn’t say anything to warrant your wild-eyed hysterics. It was a very specific criticism similar to one George Carlin articulated in the video I linked to. Nowhere did I suggest that anthropomorphic global warming was a myth; I merely suggested that a critical eye was still warranted. Some of the recent reports questioning the diligence of the IPCC, the reliability of methods of data gathering are legitimately troublesome, as is reading the copious comments made by a scientist trying to slog through some clusterfuck of a piece climate software, lamenting the “hopeless state of our databases,” among many other things.
Ultimately, even Phil Jones doesn’t share your level of certitude. Love the fire-and-brimstone, though.
The presentation of your ideas is rational and well-spoken, Mystery, but your conclusions are still misguided (I mean, the planet has completely frozen over in the past too. It would be precedented if it happened now!)
my ‘wild-eyed hysterics’? please. point out where i’m hysterical and wild-eyed.
i’m the very picture of calm, actually, but i am emphatic and passionate. i love how i write anything impassioned or fiery around the boys here and suddenly i’m ‘angry’ and ‘hysterical’. what a load of rubbish. if any of the guys had written the exact same thing, i’d bet a shiny gold coin you wouldn’t label them hysterical and wild-eyed.
but i’m sure it makes you feel better to label me hysterical, because then you get to think of yourself as calm and reasonable rather than stubborn, misguided and wrong. but you go right on ahead and delude yourself, have at it. also, you must be good at riding that unicycle to backpedal so effortlessly, mystery.
i specifically addressed points you raised, but you chose to ignore them. i can’t say i’m shocked, your right-wing proclivities are no secret and i honestly don’t care what you think past spreading your ignorance and misinformation here to people who might believe you have an actual point.
you trumpet ‘critical thinking’ but display none yourself, posting links that display a complete lack of critical thinking whatsoever on your part. you claim you aren’t arguing against the existence of climate change, and then post (weak) links to cast ‘doubt’ on it. that is contradictory, just so you know.
“As I stated, even if the worst case scenario climate alarmists have to offer came to pass, it wouldn’t be unprecedented. The polar ice caps have completely melted and reformed. Sea levels have been 100 feet higher than present levels. CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere have been much higher. Millions of species have gone extinct. So what, you ask? Right, it was just a quibble.”
good grief. yes, these things have happened in the past during the NATURAL evolution of the planet, BUT THEY WERE NOT CAUSED BY US. if you can’t see the difference, then i feel sorry for you. do WE have the right to destroy the environment along with ourselves, just because we feel like it, because it will grow back? that is one fucked-up way to view life, sorry. your attitude is disturbing.
as christian’s post also clearly pointed out, the error in the massive IRCC report is merely a blip in an ocean of peer-reviewed data. irrelevant.
further, did you actually bother to read the link you just posted TO THE END? the doubts of a couple of scientists re: the validity of a few temperature readings around the world due to placement/change of circumstance are known anomalies THAT HAVE BEEN ACCOUNTED FOR IN THE REPORT. further, recent satellite data confirms temperature findings in line with the report, in fact, WORSE than suspected.
also, temperature readings are not the sole determining factor in climate change findings, which are myriad and complex, amongst them the melting of the polar caps, which is indisputable, and the withdrawal of icecaps and glaciers recorded by satellite, also indisputable.
but keep on towing the party line, mystery, it suits you
and also importantly, the weakening of the vital ocean currents that regulate earth’s climate, which i wrote about earlier, due to the massive influx of fresh water from the melting polar caps is also observed/recorded by satellite; solid, consensus science
So, how about that Avatar? Anyone think it might do okay?
Foamy: No way. Those avatar things look too much like Smurfs for anyone to take them seriously.
jeffmcm- “The presentation of your ideas is rational and well-spoken, Mystery, but your conclusions are still misguided.”
My only conclusion was that saying “Save the Planet” is inaccurate; the planet doesn’t need saving. If these dire predictions come true, then clearly, it is devastating for humanity. But not for the planet. Certainly, you of all people recognize a semantic argument. Now, there ARE fringe environmentalists who would love to see our species decimated for the sake Mother Earth. Obviously, I’m not one of them.
You’re more interested in political semantics than I on this. If the planet dies, we die. There are some eco-kooks that think humanity is a plague on the world, but I’m not one. We are the world, you know?
I’m not sure we can save Earth from dying when we can’t even save Pandora from an asterisk.
palm: LOL LOL. Awesome.
But we DID save Pandora from a scenery-chewing character actor. Didn’t we?
Joe: Are you referring to Stephen Lang or IOIOIOI?
Back to Avatar’s box office…gotta say this weekday stretch might be the film’s most impressive yet. Yesterday and today the film was down 8% from the previous week…despite playing against its strongest competition yet and leapfrogged Wolfman and Percy Jackson back to 2nd…itll probably rise a notch or two in the weekend standings.
LYT: Stephen Lang. (Don’t get me wrong — I’m a big fan, going all the way back to Crime Story.)
EthanG: Could this be — now don’t laugh! — an Oscar bump at work?