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David Poland

By David Poland

BYOB 11/17/11

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137 Responses to “BYOB 11/17/11”

  1. doug r says:

    January Jones red dress.

  2. sanj says:

    hey DP – what new DP/30’s are you doing for Sundance festival ?

    Sundance has it’s own videos … most are under 5 minutes

  3. JoJo says:

    Sanj, you seem obsessed with the DP/30s. What gives?

  4. hcat says:

    Jones seemed to be auditioning for a remake of The Fifth Element.

    And Sanj you haven’t mentioned anything about the Globes, Of all the posters here I expected you to be the most front and center about a chance to gawk at celebrities.

  5. sanj says:

    DP/30’s are fun to watch with new actors / directors – i’m not obsessed with the box office numbers…which always to get more posts.

    Cargo 2009 movie – a nice scifi movie i liked –
    if it was made in english it would win some awards

    a nice mix of matrix and sunshine

    her’e the trailer

    sure i’d like to see a DP/30 of Cargo but probably
    not going to happen..

    every month there are movie festivals so movie reviewers are looking forward but how many movies do they miss …

    i don’t care too much about the globes – the oscars annoy me cause they are way too long – the mtv movie awards are more fun to watch….

  6. hcat says:

    Does anyone else see the Comcast/Uni merger like an engagement of two of the worst people you know? She has a lot of credit card debt he doesn’t know about, He is perpetually one urine test away from unemployment and one blood test away from child support payments. Both sets of parents are bitterly divorced and raging alcoholics. But everyone just nods their heads like its got a shot in hell.

    Comcast was the only choice for internet in my previous house and dealing with thier imcompetience got to be almost a part time job for me the first year we lived there. Their customer service was so poor that the state of Maryland had to pass specific legislation forcing them to address their customer’s needs. People I know in other states have had uniformly bad experiences with them as well and face it this is not a tough business. Hook the wire to the house and send the programs. Set the bill and stick to the price. Not exactly rocket science but they can’t seem to get it right.

    So we add to that a content company that was the hippest network for 20-25 years and then just let themselves die chasing obviously stupid ideas (XFL, Leno in Primetime). And the shit they come up with to pull themselves out of the hole? The fucking Cape? This is what you spend valuable NFL adspace promoting?

    The studio can’t keep a franchise running to save its life and when it does get something decent off the ground throws way too much money at it for it to ever make a profit.

    Now I don’t know the legal hurdles this has to pass and the Feds can’t hold up the sale on common sense alone, but this just looks like a disaster to me.

  7. sanj says:

    hey DP – you run hollywood – so get Battle Los Angles and Sucker Punch in theatres next week and make tickets 2 dollars each..

  8. sanj says:

    DP/30…individual…MTV movie awards…Sucker Punch…#mustbeafake

  9. sanj says:

    Steve Carell is out of the Office very soon – so what are the chances he’ll be a huge movie star ? he can do 4-6 films a year with one big hit ..does anybody care ?

    the Office is one of the only comedies that have like 8 producters and yet i don’t find it funny anymore ..
    but everybody gets paid big money

  10. leahnz says:

    wtf are you talking about sanj

  11. sanj says:

    leahnz – the office = do you watch it ?
    the main guy on there is leaving the show

  12. leahnz says:

    yes, i know. i was just about to post a disclaimer stating my ‘wtf’ comment was a rhetorical question… it was more concerning the other weird random shit you posted before your ‘office’ comment that prompted my faux consternation.

    (there is only one ‘the office’ to me and it’s set in slough)

  13. leahnz says:

    from the real office, somehow fitting w/gervais the topic of chin-wagging at the mo:

    midget vs dwarf vs elf:

    (nobody does painful dry cringe humour like the pommes. tho there are some brill examples of yank-style cringe humour, ‘bad santa’ one of my faves)

  14. hcat says:

    Still suprised no enterprising home video company has imported the other Offices from around the globe. I think there are at least three others than Brit and American, and I would love to take a look at them.

    As for Carell, I can’t imagine he’ll be a bigger star than he already is. While amiable he still doesn’t have that great of range. More films a year may only wear out his welcome. His income will improve but don’t see him creating some great body of work or becoming a major superstar.

    Somewhat related to Carell, I saw Dinner for Schmucks recently and Jermaine Clement seems to be going for the ‘Smallest Variation between roles Lifetime Acheivement Award.’ Bobcat Goldthwait mixed it up more in his early roles.

  15. Paul MD (Stella's Boy) says:

    Watched a Solitary Man/Greenberg double feature the other night. Surprised by how much I was moved by and enjoyed Solitary Man. A stellar cast complimenting an absolutely superb Michael Douglas, some really sharp writing, a brisk pace, and a nice balance of the funny and the serious. Wish it received more attention. Greenberg didn’t do much for me. I am an enormous Squid and the Whale fan and keep hoping Baumbach is going to find some of that magic again, but he hasn’t been able to. The acting is fine and it has its moments, but Greenberg never feels like a real person to me and the movie’s kind of just there. I’ve already mostly forgotten about it while Solitary Man has stuck with me. Interesting that both movies end in similar fashion.

    Anyone else watch the Lights Out pilot? It’s off to a great start.

  16. Krillian says:

    Totally agree on Solitary Man and Greenberg.

  17. torpid bunny says:

    Numerous times I’ve had comcast reps break down my bill in detail and promise me the exact number it will be. It’s always higher.

  18. JKill says:

    I’ll backup the love for SOLITARY MAN. Watched it this weekend, and I found it a moving, funny, human and engaging movie that I’m surprised hasn’t ended up on more best of year lists. Douglas is wonderful and affecting in a role that couldn’t be more perfect for him. A great directorial effort from Koppelman/Levien. I was quite taken with the simple, yet effective compositions that reminded me a bit of Ashby, and the writing is really impressive. (I was also a fan of their debut KNOCKAROUND GUYS too, know that I think about it…)

  19. jesse says:

    Huh. I really wished I liked Solitary Man more than I did, given how much I love GIRLFRIEND EXPERIENCE and most of the cast. I enjoyed the movie well enough, but it seemed to just sort of go through the motions for that sort of material. It never really hit me with any kind of surprise or new energy — the writing you guys are praising is exactly where the movie felt routine to me, and exactly what I love about Baumbach: the writing in Margot at the Wedding and Greenberg is fantastic, really sharp and, in its own way, hilarious. I do sometimes wish he’d do more of a direct comedy again a la Kicking and Screaming (one of my favorite movies ever), Mr. Jealousy (OK, not great, but very funny), or Highball (barely released, Baumbach took his name off it, yet: one of the funniest movies I’ve seen). But Greenberg was one of my favorites of 2010, with one of the best endings.

  20. Nick Rogers says:

    jesse: Agreed on the ending of “Greenberg,” especially the connotations of her saying, “This is you” to close it out. To me, one of the best endings to a grounded, dialogue- and character-driven romantic comedy since “Before Sunset.”

  21. Paul MD (Stella's Boy) says:

    Isn’t the ending of Greenberg pretty similar to that of Solitary Man’s? Another reminder of how subjective comedy is since your description of Greenberg is exactly how I feel about Solitary Man. I never for a second bought Stiller as a carpenter and a guy who was in a band this close to being famous.

  22. sanj says:

    Kristen Stewart photoshopped in Vogue Magazine

  23. JKill says:

    I think the endings are quite similar, both literally and thematically, without going into spoiler territory. While their life journies are very different, both protagonists are kind of stuck in a state of stagnation, and find themselves kind of at a crossroads where they could continue on as they have their whole lives or take a chance and try to become more genuine and engaged and less cynical. I found both very uplifting.

    Also to clarify, I came here to praise SOLITARY MAN, not to bury GREEENBERG. I loved GREENBERG. It had wonderful writing, great performances, and I really connected with it personally. Baumbach can do no wrong, in my eyes. (I finally saw HIGHBALL recently, and while it was very funny, it is definitely, to paraphrase from TSATW, minor Baumbach.)

  24. jesse says:

    PaulMD, I liked the ending of Solitary Man well enough, and it’s sort of similar to Greenberg’s, but I feel like it’s the less incisive, more generic version. A lot of movies use that ending where (SPOILER?) you close on the main character alone, silent, sitting somewhere. It’s often a nice way to end things. But as Nick points out, there’s more interaction in the Greenberg scene; it’s a lovely (but still not completely resolved) moment between Stiller and Gerwig.

    You’re right; comedy is even more subjective than most elements. I didn’t find Solitary Man all that funny. Sometimes lightly amusing, but there’s more of a comic point of view in Greenberg (the character)’s dialogue.

  25. Paul MD (Stella's Boy) says:

    I think I expected to like Greenberg more than I did because Armond White hated it, it received numerous glowing reviews, and (as I mentioned) I adore Squid and the Whale so much. I just didn’t feel any connection to the lead character, and I found his quirks (the letter writing) forced and not really all that amusing.

  26. sanj says:

    i didn’t like Greenburg or Squid and the Whale

    Noah Baumbach is too complicated to me – there should be
    a cheat sheet to understand his films … like cliff notes
    for shakespeare ..or the idiots guide to Noah Baumbach movies …one of you movie critics should write this and make millions.

  27. AdamL says:

    I loved Solitary Man as well and thought Douglas was terrific. Am surprised by the lack of awards traction for his performance.

  28. yancyskancy says:

    Wow, I can’t believe sanj is casually throwing around multi-million dollar ideas like that. Dibs!

  29. anghus says:

    i saw Green Hornet. I didn’t hate it, there were some entertaining moments. But i find myself tired of Seth Rogen, who has 2 types of performance he delivers in every movie.

    1. Mumbling/Soft Spoken rambling
    2. Loud, Andre the Giant level grunting

  30. christian says:

    Sanj, you’re killing me.

  31. Jeffrey Boam's Doctor says:

    Sanj must be a performance piece.
    Whoever is behind it needs to be given a TV Series.
    Sanj’s Guide to Pop Culture and Stuff.

  32. Triple Option says:

    hcat, I really hadn’t thought of it in those terms but had my misgivings too since I first heard the announcements. I’m totally feeling you on the common sense thing. To me, it falls in the same boat as the NFL’s proposed move to 18 games. No matter how much fans rant and complain, if 23 people decide it’s a go, it’s a go. I just hate the helplessness of it all. I actually talked to some legal people from other big media congloms and while they still kinda have to toe the company line, no one’s really thought the deal’s such a good deal, even for the main participants, except maybe short term. But no one’s going to challenge it because no one knows if it’ll be them (their firm) in the same position a few years down the line. If like 2-3 major competitors raised objections, it would supposedly seriously hamper if not kill the merger through the process. No one’s going to step up, though.

    I did try to think how will it effect me. I don’t have comcast. And it’s on them if I don’t watch any of the uni channels but still, I just feel somehow me or the avg consumer’s gonna pay for this in one way or another. Like some type of tolls on bathroom stalls are coming. It’ll be sold as expanded kitchen privileges and menu selection but overall we’ll know that life was better back at sq one. But there’ll be nothing anyone can do. Except choose to do w/out and be totally in the dark.

  33. hcat says:

    I was not hesitant because of the ominous implications of giant corporations getting together, more on the implications of two companies that don’t know how to run their businesses creating a giant monster to stumble around in the dark. Universal has been traded around so much in the past quarter centuary they never got to grow a current synergistic business model like Viacom, Disney or Warners. GE kept suitors away from NBC while it was making bank but let it fall to the wayside. Pairing with Comcast was a Last Call Don’t Want To Sleep Alone tonight option. I don’t think this will affect consumers all that much with the possible exception of NBC Uni content suffering from overly tight cost cutting.

    But as long as Focus remains autonomous and funded, I don’t really care what happens to the rest of the company.

  34. IOv3 says:

    Comcast Universal has some smart people in it. The dude running NBC now is not a complete idiot and he comes from Comcast. While NBCU has Bonnie Hammer. Easily the best TV exec in all of the business. If they let her run their combined channels. The TV business will be fine.

    Now, with the movie division, they are fucked. Seriously, unless Bonnie Hammer can also run a fucking movie studio, Universal is fucked. Shit, they should sell Universal to Mark Cuban and save themselves the trouble of trying to turn that studio around.

  35. christian says:

    America’s anti-trust laws are a complete sham.

  36. anghus says:

    did you guys see the first image from XMEN: First Class.

    High holy hell does it look silly. Of course, we need to see it in action, but the image is kind of ridiculous. In a ‘If it was Kick Ass it would make sense but this is supposedly a non humurous super hero film’ kind of way.

  37. IOv3 says:

    Anghus, I think that’s the tone they were going for with that flick. If you use those unis, especially the Emma Frost outfit, it’s bound to be some what silly. Nevertheless, it really has to be better than that god damn Wolverine movie. I mean, really, it just has to be better.

  38. Hallick says:

    The Emma Frost outfit looks straight off the fembot rack in Austin Powers. But the movie is set in the 1960’s, so cutting edge uniform design isn’t really an option, I guess.

  39. sanj says:

    if Noah Baumbach watched more Michael Bay movies he could totally make Squid and Whale 2 – squid vs whale
    just get Jessie Eisnberg to go hunting for the squid and the whale with his Zombieland friends .

  40. JB Moore says:

    GOOD IDEA Sanj.

  41. yancyskancy says:

    Coming to SyFy — SQUALE!

  42. IOv3 says:

    So Anne Hathaway is Catwoman and Tom Hardy is Bane. Anne’s the only woman in Hollywood who could pull off Catwoman. While having Hardy play Bane basically means Bats conversion to EVIL did not exactly convince the bad guys, and they have brought Bane in to do the job the Joker did not finish.

  43. anghus says:

    So after all the shit Kevin Smith gave ‘critics’ about Cop Out, he starts telling tales of Bruce Willis being an uncooperative dick while filming.

    Man, Smith has turned into the loudest, crankiest filmmaker online. The last 2-3 years has seen him piss on critics, airlines, and now the people who star in the mediocre product he’s been cranking out.

    So sad. As a guy whose love of film came out of he late 80’s/early 90’s indie film scene, it’s kind of depressing that when you see the name ‘Kevin Smith’ and equate it with old man online bitching.

  44. MarkVH says:

    I dig the idea of going with Bane (though I was kind of excited about Deadshot and/or Hugo Strange), but I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t bummed that Nolan’s going back to Catwoman. While I don’t doubt that Hathaway will be terrific in the role, it just seems like we’ve seen this character done so many times before. Would have preferred Talia as a way of completing the circle from the first film. Ah well, what do I know? Here’s hoping.

  45. Don R. Lewis says:

    Noah Baumbach’s first film, KICKING AND SCREAMING is one of my all-time faves. Check it out!

  46. Triple Option says:

    I’m really not a hater when it comes to corp mergers. It’d be hard to backup my position w/out going into a long, non/quasi industry related rant, but, despite the fact that I have cable and made little difference to me what 3 numbers I punched into my remote to watch this year’s college football National Championship game, I have a REAL problem with that game being taken off of broadcast TV and moved to a pay channel. I don’t like the Uni/Comcast merger, which, I admit, is based more on speculation than a working model example. Sure, one could look at it the same as Time Warner, of which I have my issues, though Time Warner came to its position from different set of circumstances and means, but I just think this will lead down a different road of possible troubles.

    angus, I didn’t hear what Smith said, but he’s not the first to bitch about Willis though, is he? I’d imagine there being sliding scales or how “cooperative” big name talent can be, but I remember Willis having some director thrown off a project after his softcore fiasco. He may’ve been right to do so, I seem to remember hearing about his strong, on-set personality, which I think was even present back on Die Hard. He seemed to make the right choices and I don’t doubt the guy can be reasoned in his approach. I guess what I’m saying is I wouldn’t count this as sour grapes for Smith.

    **EDIT: Ahhh, I misread, angus. Smith gave critics a hard time not the other way around. I guess these things can be mutually exclusive but I get more what you’re saying.

  47. anghus says:

    I think Bane could be done very well. If you take a little bit of Hugo Strange, Hush, and Bane and make it one character. The whole point of Bane was that he saw himself as the other side of the mirror.

    The Dark Knight nailed the Joker as a guy who wants to play with Batman. To challenge him, to expose his faith in Gotham as a sick joke. When Batman asks the Joker why he wants to kill him… how does the Joker reply?

    “I don’t want to kill you! What would I do without you? Go back to ripping off Mob dealers? No, no… no! No, you… you… complete… me.”

    The Joker saw Batman as his other half. Order vs. Chaos.

    Bane is something different. Bane sees Batman as his physical and intellectual equal, a challenge to be bested. The Joker wanted Batman to watch Gotham burn and devolve into anarchy. Bane wants Batman to die, but he wants to be the one to do it. Batman’s defeat must come at Bane’s hands. And he will push himself beyond the limit to accomplish this goal. We’ve seen 2 Batman movies where the goal was to reign in the chaos unfolding in Gotham.

    It’d be nice to see one where it’s more of a intellectual chess game. That’s what Bane could be.

  48. sanj says:

    Noah Baumbach’s first film, KICKING AND SCREAMING

    fine i’ll give it a chance …

    but why isn’t Baumbach over here discussing his movies ?

  49. Martin s says:

    Selina Kylie will be a disguise for Thalia and Bane will work for Ras.

  50. Geoff says:

    I’m pretty excited about this casting – both actors seem to have pretty amazing range. I have no doubt that the studio loves Hathaway as a name to put above the title, but she’s still got the chops.

    Although, I was NEVER a huge fan of Jack Nicholson’s Joker, but I was a big fan of Michelle Pfeiffer’s Catwoman – truly an iconic character and performance that will not be easily topped. Man, whatever happened to Michelle Pfeiffer?????

  51. Geoff says:

    Kicking and Screaming was pretty damn good, but am the only one who was truly irritated by The Squid and the Whale and Greenberg? I know Baumbach’s MO is truly unpleasant characters, but at least give them a purpose or drive a la early Neil LaBute movies.

    I still find myself irritated by the subplot in ‘Whale that NOBODY initially notices that Jesse Eisenberg’s character is plagiarizing Pink Floyd’s Hey You during his concert performance – come on, it’s only featured on one the top five selling albumns of all freaking time!

  52. Telemachos says:

    Hathaway will be great as Catwoman. I’m not super excited about that character simply because we’ve seen so many iterations of her already. Still, no doubt Nolan will bring something new to the table, and Hathaway’s as good a choice as any for the part.

    I’m not that familiar with Bane’s character, so initially I wasn’t that enthusiastic. However, Tom Hardy can do no wrong, and anyone who thinks he can’t be an intimidating physical presence should watch BRONSON. The more I think about the bare-bones concept of Bane, though, the more potential I see.

  53. hcat says:

    I was hoping for news of Deep Roy as Bat-Mite. Sigh, the wait continues.

    Everything I have read up to this point stated the female lead was going to be Thalia. The Reporter article mentions that Nolan’s press release doesn’t mention Catwoman by name. Is it possible Catwoman might be speculation on the press’s part?

  54. storymark says:

    Catwoman is in the press release. Nothing official was ever said about Talia – it was just widely assumed.

  55. NickF says:

    Is that Hathaway bashing surprising to anyone? most uncultured fanboys probably think she’s only ever been in Disney stuff, specifically Princess Diaries. They appear oblivious to the more substantive roles she’s had since then.

    If she’s just Selina Kyle I hope Nolan is up to running with the seductive nature of her character. One of Nolan’s fallacies is the inability to serve his female characters as well a their male characters. I had thought the same was true with Inception. My opinion changed greatly on the Marion Cotillard’s character in Inception. After my first two viewing, one theatrically, one on Blu-ray, I hadn’t warmed up to the emotional core of the movie that revolves around what Leo is doing to Marion’s character. Then I saw it once again on Christmas day and it all clicked. She conveys the torment of what Leo has been doing to her after performing Inception on her. This character is the best of any female in Nolan’s career.

    Hathaway can pull off the seductive and sheepish role that character deserves. Will Chris and brother who writes these movies do her justice? that’s to be determined.

  56. sanj says:

    i figure the catwoman role will be minor ..unless of course catwoman saves batman in the last 30 minutes from the bad guy in the movie .

    Hathaway has done roles with crazy makeup like Alice in Wonderland but i also figure this role demands she do stunts lets see how that turns out… well she did do
    some stunts for Get Smart ..

    also Bride Wars is totally painful to watch ..

  57. NickF says:

    Not to gloat, but I know better than to sit down and watch something like Bride Wars.

  58. sanj says:

    one of the bad things about the next Batman film is that they can’t risk getting less known actors ..huge budget. huge movie.

    also Regis Phibin is leaving tv . anybody care ? he’s been on tv for 50 years ..thats gotta mean something ?

  59. movieman says:

    Man, whatever happened to Michelle Pfeiffer?????

    …she was unceremoniously (and undeservedly) pushed aside as Meryl Streep ravenously devoured every role for 50+ actresses in H’wood.
    But you can probably say the same thing about Jessica Lange and a few dozen other wonderful “mature” actresses (Judy Davis, Sigourney Weaver, Glenn Close, Geena Davis, etc.) that we don’t see nearly enough of these days.
    And people wonder what my beef is with La Streep.

  60. leahnz says:

    “This character is the best of any female in Nolan’s career.”

    re: marion as mal, i couldn’t disagree more.

    her perf is one of the weakest links in ‘inception’ for me, she’s just an empty vessel, a cardboard cutout that does these random shit things and i couldn’t care less about her, because while mal is a tumour of sorts and her character does have very limited time to develop, to work mal needs to endear in her human form, to convey warmth and fragility and elicit empathy so that we then pity her – as well as fear her – in her unfortunate state of malignancy within the dream construct, neither of which she achieved in my eyes; she was just an annoying nothing with no gravitas or presence, she’d show up and it was like, ‘eh, there’s mal. she’s bad. whatever.’ (and i’ve seen it 3 times or 4 times even so it’s not like i haven’t given her a good go)

    nolan isn’t interested in telling women’s stories – their interior lives are of no consequence, strictly supporting fodder to the male protag (and i count myself as a fan of the englishman) – but as far as compelling female characters goes mal is WAY down my list of nolan’s best chicks, topped by the genuinely engaging perfs of moss as natalie and swank as ellie in ‘memento’ and ‘insomnia’

    edited to say: pfeiffer was a hoot in ‘hairspray’, i hope she can at least carve out a latter-day career for herself in meaty character roles, since ‘leading lady’ roles are hard to come by for women past a certain age

  61. Geoff says:

    Movieman, WHY is that Streep’s fault, exactly?

    Meryl Street was MERYL STREEP years before Michelle Pfeiffer was a big mainstream star – she never stopped being Meryl Streep.

    There was at least a time when if Michelle Pfeiffer starred in a movie, it was a mark of quality – that kind of ended with Dangerous Minds.

  62. IOv3 says:

    Ariande is actually Nolan’s best female character outside of Carrie-Anne Moss in Memento. Remember Memento? Strong female presence in that film from CAM and Jorga Fox. Still, everything that happens at the end of Inception happens because of Ariande. Cobb does not get his catharsis without her building a dream to give it to him.

    Now, you want to go on about caring about their interior lives then look to the examples above because those three characters define the movies they are in with what makes them tick on the inside. Mal, however, is a manifestation of guilt and regret. What more would you expect from a character that exist solely as a construct that torments the protagonist of the movie?

    That aside; Catwoman has never ever been captured properly on film. Her own movie sucked and Tim Burton Batman films are about as relevant to Batman as my shoes. Seriously, Catwoman is one of the greatest characters in all of the Bat books. If you have some Borderbucks, go and pick up some of her trades from her past few years, and get to know one of DC’s best characters. Nolan would have been an idiot to not use Catwoman in his films and he did set it up with the previous film. Come on folks. Work with me here.

  63. leahnz says:

    are you talking to me in the above, io? if not, never mind, but if so, i agree about ariadne, a great character – and page is perfect in the role – but ariadne isn’t explored anywhere near to her potential, which is one of the problems i have with ‘inception’, too much time spent on silly nonsensical shootouts and not enough on the things that really matter. very frustrating.

    and ftr i mentioned moss in memento in my post above re: my fave nolan women, so yes, i do remember memento as per my comment just prior to yours.

    as for catwoman, i’m not feeling hathaway at all. but it depends on what nolan is going for; if he goes back to the origin well with selena as slinky catburgler, we’ll see. i’m feeling hardy tho, as i always do. he’ll bring it and be impossibly suave whilst doing so.

  64. Triple Option says:

    This has been brought up on these boards before. Though it’s been many, many years since seeing the old Batman series re-runs when I was a kid, Eartha Kitt’s is still memorable enough for me to picture her as what I would imagine a good catwoman should be. I suppose I could picture Hathaway being a more sullen catwoman but even after seeing a variety of her films, I can’t really picture her as one who’d rip teh flesh from her victims. (so to speak).

  65. leahnz says:

    yes, hathaway is just too ‘goody two shoes’ for the cat.

    thinking about bane, wasn’t he hispanic in the comics? is this yet another ‘whitewashing’ for the sake of marketability or whathaveyou? i’m sure hardy will be great but it would be nice to have a brown person play a brown character once in a blue moon.

  66. christian says:

    Sean Young would have been the perfect Catwoman.

  67. IOv3 says:

    Leah, they were directed at you sort of, but I just wanted to make a more broad declarative statement with that post. I also completely missed you bringing up CAM in Memento. My apologies.

    That aside, Inception is basically about finding one’s catharsis. Cobb needs to find his and Fischer needs to find his with his father. Basically that entire movie is about regret and that’s what it’s focused on. Which is why few parts of the plot are as important as the protagonist being healed and that alone is why we can have an Inception sequel. A healed Cobb would make for an interesting movie.

    Finally, Hathaway not only has the physique for Catwoman. She also is just an awesome actress. She’s everything Nolan needed for Catwoman and I would imagine his Catwoman to be a more modern take. A Catwoman who will be the first person to really get Bruce to focus and be the hero he needs to be. Seriously, that’s what Catwoman does. She kicks ass, takes name, and tells Bruce to cut the shit when he’s acting a fool. She’s the perfect actress to portray the current Catwoman. Who, again, is fucking awesome.

  68. yancyskancy says:

    Love Hathaway, but she doesn’t really have that feline thing I expect from a good Catwoman. Pfeiffer was awesome.

    I’m with Geoff — I’m not seeing how Streep can be blamed for Pfeiffer’s career faltering. Streep doesn’t hire herself, you know. She’s the only woman her age who’s a box office draw, so that’s who the studios look to hire when those rare “woman of a certain age” roles come along. Doesn’t make it suck any less for her peers, of course, but I’m not sure what she can do about it outside of refusing to work.

  69. Krillian says:

    I trust Nolan. I thought Heath Ledger was a weird choice for Joker and had a fond memory of Jack’s, but then Heath made Jack look like Cesar Romero. So with Hathaway, I’m ready for her to surprise me.

    Pfeiffer just got cast as Chris Pine’s mom in Welcome to People. She had a couple straight-to-DVD flicks, Cheri didn’t make a peep, Stardust and Hairspray were in 2007. Pfeiffer strikes me as one of those actors of a certain age the public to dying to re-embrace, like her Fabulous Baker Boy co-star Jeff Bridges.

  70. anghus says:

    whoever said ‘Selina Kyle is really Ras daughter’

    holy shit. that would be a great way to tie all the films together. the daughter who seeks out the one who took down the league of shadows and her father.

    what better way to lure batman in then pose as a criminal.

    that’d be a brilliant way to play it. excellent speculation.

  71. aframe says:

    If NEXT TO NORMAL is ever made into a film (and hopefully not by Rob Reiner, who says he’s dying to do it; not sure he can pull it off), it has tour de force for Pfeiffer written all over it.

  72. IOv3 says:

    Yeah you can’t have Thalia be Selina because Catwoman is a bigger character than Thalia. The only reason to bring Thalia into the Nolan universe of Bats, would be Damien. Outside of that, Thalia and Selina being the same person is just plain stupid, especially with the very strong possibility that Thalia will be in the movie anyway. Remember the casting notice for last year: Two female leads. One down. One to go.

    Yance, the feline thing is totally not Catwoman. She’s a cat burglar who wears a cat outfit. She doesn’t slink about like a cat and that’s the problem with previous adaptations.

  73. hcat says:

    Hathaway so far is a little uptown for the role but I think she could rise to the challenge. Overall Eva Green would have been perfect for the role, but not a big enough name for the marquee. Hardy is perfect, as someone mentioned above Bronson is practically an audition reel for a Nolan Bat-villian.

    This is shaping up to look like it could be a hit.

  74. hcat says:

    On an unBat note, just finished watching Salt and it may have been the diminished demands of watching it at home, or possibly the few whiskeys I enjoyed during the screening but I really dug it.

    In the last few years Columbia has been shaping up to look like Paramount did in the 80’s. Somewhat assembly line but reliable pics with a workmanlike attitude but a lot of fun underneath. A couple of real gems popping up from here to there but mostly just reliable triples (though I haven’t ventured near any Sandler films so I may have an inflated opinion of their recent slates).

  75. cadavra says:

    Didn’t Pfeiffer take time off to raise her kids? And she was always a bit on the picky side.

    As for Glenn Close, she’s been busy the last four years starring on a TV series called DAMAGES. And Sigourney Weaver, per the IMDb, has been averaging three or four pictures a year–including a little-seen item called AVATAR–and has five in the can, so I’d hardly call her inactive.

  76. IOv3 says:

    Hcat, I dig Salt as well. It’s very much a Gene Hackman action film straight out of 1987 but starring Angelina instead.

  77. Triple Option says:

    Lena Olin, speaking of 50+ actresses who should be working more, would’ve made a great catwoman.

    I was going to say I’ll have to come back w/a few names but really what’s the point??? I wonder how Framke Potente would’ve done?? I wonder how Sofia Vegarararaaaa would look trying to fight in a catwoman suit? Sexiness, yes. Attitude, check. But would she look like some of those ex Playmates who used to do those action/T&A cablers back in the late 80’s? Sofia could have her own mouse trap. Just go around in a trenchcoat all day, then if she wanted to say break into a bank, she’d walk, let the coat fall to the floor, revealing her in a catwoman costume and all the guys freeze in their track like they’re locked in a trap, with sort of a dazed look on their faces.

  78. yancyskancy says:

    Looks-wise, Olivia Wilde would’ve been an interesting choice, but I don’t like to speculate much about this sort of thing without seeing how the character is conceived in the script. I’m sure Nolan is rethinking the character to some degree, as he did with the Joker, and Hathaway will undoubtedly be up to the challenge.

  79. IOv3 says:

    Olivia Wilde is very old school Catwoman. This is what Nolan’s went after and found in Hathaway:

    Do you guys see it now?

  80. sanj says:

    Kim Kardashian as Catwoman ?

  81. IOv3 says:

    Sanj, who is your daddy and what does he do?

  82. sanj says:

    if the Catwoman character in the movie is only in it for 10 minutes – does it really matter who gets the role ?

    Batman movie going to cost 100 million – so nobody on a reality show is going to get a role ..

  83. movieman says:

    Aside from the fact that Streep is batting .250 at best these days (“Julie and Julia,” yes; “It’s Complicated,” no; “Doubt,” no; “Mamma Mia!,” no; “Prada,” hell yes!), I’m just sick and tired of seeing her name attached to every project requiring a 50+ actress. Maybe I should blame the lack of imagination in Hollywood instead of Streep, but it’s still wearying.
    Particularly since so many wonderful actresses like Pfeiffer, Lange, et al are sitting around doing nada most of the time. (Does anyone remember that silly straight-to-dvd romcom Pfeiffer did with Paul Rudd for Amy Heckerling?)
    Yes, Close had a field day toplining “Damages” (too bad last season was so disappointing), and Weaver was in “Avatar” (hardly a Ripley-caliber part, though), but Streep seems like the only actress from that “generation” who seems to regularly/routinely headline movies, even ones she’s not right for (“Doubt” is a perfect example where they went with the “Streep Brand” rather than an actress who might have done the role justice–e.g., Cherry Jones who won a Tony for the same role on B’way).
    What country (or solar system) does Sanj hail from?????

  84. Eric says:

    Hathaway: She seems too young and fragile for a role that demands a more commanding actress. Triple Option got it right: Franka Potente would have been perfect.

    But, as others above have said, Nolan has cast actors for these movies that seemed wrong on paper but ended up being perfect on screen. So I’m not going to worry too much.

    Is it true that the press release refers to the character only as Selina Kyle, and not as Catwoman? If so, he could be setting up a future film. That’d be a surprise, as the third is supposedly Nolan’s last, and he proved with Dark Knight that he’s willing to overstuff a movie if he doesn’t think he’s coming back.

  85. Anghus says:

    DIdnt they already confirm naomi watts for the new batman as well

  86. Martin S says:

    Anghus – “whoever said ‘Selina Kyle is really Ras daughter”

    Thanks, Anghus. If I didn’t say it earlier, you had the best perspective in the Tucson threads. Stella had some solid points, I should also add.

    IO – “Yeah you can’t have Thalia be Selina because Catwoman is a bigger character than Thalia.

    What does that have to do with anything? This isn’t the 90’s where choices were based upon name recognition. Nolan went with Scarecrow and Ra’s for godsakes, so I don’t think he’s concerned. If he was, why not Penguin or Riddler before Bane?

    Outside of that, Thalia and Selina being the same person is just plain stupid, especially with the very strong possibility that Thalia will be in the movie anyway. Remember the casting notice for last year: Two female leads. One down. One to go.

    Thalia has been apart of the Nolan/Goyer conversation, written in and out, since Begins.

    The two major themes have been identity and escalation. In Begins, you have three forms of identity. The Jekyll/Hyde split of Wayne/Batman, the mental psychosis of Crane which manifests through the Scarecrow mask and the deliberate deception of Ras as Ducard. In TDK, Joker takes Scarecrow’s psychosis a step farther by discarding the mask, scarring his mouth and never really explaining if he’s wearing makeup or did he have his face tatted. With Two-Face, you had the physical merger of the Jekyll/Hyde split, leading to external conflict.

    So with TDKRises, you have Bane taking Joker’s body modification to the next level while returning to the psychosis of needing a mask,(and drugs), like Scarecrow to complete his transformation. With Catwoman, you have a return to the physical Jekyll/Hyde split, and that’s about all. It’s not as if Kyle embraces her Catwoman persona more than Wayne does Batman. She simply uses it for personal gain. So what does introducing Thalia as another character bring to the mix? I guess they could explore deception, (Catwoman is honest with a mask, Thalia is a living lie), but that leaves little room for Kyle as a fleshed out character…besides becoming a complete retread of the Wayne/Kyle relationship in Returns.

    IMO, Kyle as a disguise for Thalia makes sense because it’s what Ra’s did as Ducard to gain Wayne’s trust to destroy Gotham, and a Nolan Catwoman, as a variation on the League of Shadows ninja design, works because that is a logical extension in Nolan’s vision of how Batman works. Things do not spontaneously generate, not even the Joker.

    Then when you look at the title, TDK Rises, it’s another play on double-meanings. TDK was not just a reference to Batman but also a “dark night” over Gotham. “Rises” is not just a reference to Batman regaining his place as hero, but implies Bane breaking his back and an escalation of things going from bad to worse. That should most likely be a crossing of Knightfall and No Man’s Land, especially when you see they’re going to shoot in Detroit, a city wanting to blow parts of itself up for the right price.

  87. cadavra says:

    Hathaway did some pretty convincing ass-kicking in GET SMART (admittedly it was a comedy, but still), so I’d give her the benefit of the doubt. Wilde was the first person who came to my mind as well, but that just may be further proof of her “obviousness” for the role.

    Movieman: Apart from the fact that your math is off (one out of five would be .200), you also ain’t making much of a case for your argument. Four of the five movies you cite were unqualified hits, and the fifth, the modestly-budgeted DOUBT, did far more business than even MGM thought it would and actually showed a profit. (Five Oscar noms, four of them for acting, didn’t hurt.)

    Also, apart from MORNING GLORY, in which she was not the lead, Diane Keaton’s track record of late hasn’t been bad, either.

  88. Don R. Lewis says:

    I leave for Sundance in the morning (at 3 am actually, because the only thing I’m worse at than packing is booking sensible flights) and am actually pretty excited for alot of the films. However, I’m still IRATE that Kevin Smith is sticking to his guns and not showing RED STATE for the press.

    I am a big fan yet am constantly annoyed at Smith’s inability to let stuff go. I agree with much of his sentiment about the blogosphere piling on COP OUT and parroting one another, but why do we ALL have to suffer? Pisses me off.

    Anyway, it’ll be nice to kick back and see movies, write reviews and hang with friends. Having our film there last year was draaaaaining.

  89. Pete B says:

    Not bashing Anne Hathaway, but I was really wanting Emily Blunt for the part. So now I’ve been robbed of seeing her as the Black Widow and Catwoman. Maybe they’ll try another remake of The Avengers and I’ll finally see her in a black body suit? Just hoping…

  90. IOv3 says:

    He’s not showing Red State to the press even though the press did nothing wrong to him with Cop Out, since he has admitted all of his piss and vigor was a front? Really? He’s such a tool that it depresses me that I ever enjoyed the work of one of the more half-assed fucking individuals in Hollywood.

    That aside; Martin, what you wrote is a 90s superhero movie. It’s not about NAME RECOGNITION with Catwoman (she’s listed as CATWOMAN in the press release) but Catwoman being a character that has had name recognition for close to 50 years. They know they fucked the character up with that movie with Hallie Berry and now they are going to fix it.

    Seriously, Thalia is Thalia and Catwoman is Catwoman. The fact that you are ignoring a casting notice that mentioned TWO FEMALE leads to put forth this hokey 90s silliness, is pretty astounding. If you want a 90s comic book movie, go watch freaking Green Hornet. If you want something modern, go see TDKR, and have yourself an ELEVATOR PARTY ELEVATOR PARTY ELEVATOR PARTY!!!!

  91. hcat says:

    Pete B, you ever see My Summer of Love? If you are a big Blunt fan, that was where she first started coming to people’s attention.

  92. Pete B says:


    No I haven’t, but thanks, I’ll be sure to check it out now.

  93. sanj says:

    how abou5 3 versions of Batman in 1 year

    1 costs 10 million – has no name actors – reality stars but with solid script

    1 costs 50 million – big name stars with decent script

    1 costs 100 million + the Nolan one with super amazing scrip thats Ain’t it Cool News approved with 50% approval from the gurus of gold

    thats a lot of Batman for everybody and Warner bros makes a lot more money

  94. Nick Rogers says:

    Kevin Smith has gone into full-tilt pretentious douchebaggishness with his anti-critic screed. It’s not that he’s hiding RED STATE from the press; he’s just limiting it to those he considers friends within that brethren and screening it at his house. So instead of real criticism, you’ll get glorified book blurbs. The film could be great, but this holier-than-thou attitude does, as a previous commenter pointed out, make him seem like the Internet’s cranky old man with a wifebeater, argyle socks and a hose.

  95. movieman says:

    Cad- I’m not disputing the fact that the movies were hits, just that Streep was miscast in most of them (especially “Doubt” which was Miramax, not MGM btw) because she’s the only actress of her generation who’s getting offered the job(s). Which kind of makes it a self-fulfilling prophecy. Most of those films (especially “Complicated” or “Mia!”) would have probably done perfectly well without Streep.
    I routinely championed Streep back when people made fun of her accent prowess. And now I find myself in the weird position of knocking
    her…for all of the reasons previously cited. It’s not that I have anything against the woman per se. I just wish that she wasn’t starring in every third movie that comes along (yes, I know my math is off again; it just seems like every third movie).

  96. yancyskancy says:

    sanj: “1 costs 10 million – has no name actors – reality stars but with solid script”

    I’m on this. Commissioning a script by Noah Baumbach. Casting Spencer Pratt (Prattman?). Villains: The Riddler (The Real World’s Puck) and the Penguin (Snooki!). Now I just need the 10 million.

  97. leahnz says:

    i actually agree with io on the face of it, i think it’s very unlikely that selena will be talia in disguise, way too repetitive in theme and a middle finger to the source to boot, really fucking around with the batman ethos to which nolan has so far remained rather faithful. his hyper-real sensibility in depicting gotham and its cast of heroes and cops and crazies and villains utilising a grittier ‘crime drama’ approach (esp. in TDK) is a unique new spin on the batman universe, but so far nolan hasn’t made any drastic departures from characters in terms of function or form. selena kyle/catwoman and talia al ghul are two very distinct and iconic characters in their own right; for nolan to effectively merge them into one would be rather blasphemous and offensive to their iconic status, i don’t see nolan going there and taking that liberty (esp. given that the casting call/screen-test process was clearly for two actresses, talia al ghul having long been rumoured to be one of the female roles in no. 3, catwoman rather more of a surprise). i think it’s far more likely that selena and talia emerge as two anti-hero/possible romantic interests in a love triangle with our gravel-voice grumpus-dumpus bat in his redemption arc, that’s my guess.

    “Rises” is not just a reference to Batman regaining his place as hero, but implies Bane breaking his back and an escalation of things going from bad to worse.”

    fwiw i don’t get that, that doesn’t make any sense.

    (‘the dark knight rises’ is about the silliest title yet, calling to mind morning wood, yeast bread, slowly getting out of bed, and what should be the sun. gee, why didn’t they go whole hog with the stunningly original titles and call it ‘the dark night returns’, or ‘revenge of the dark knight’, or ‘the dark knight comes back’. yikes. then again, ‘batman begins’ wasn’t exactly the height of flair in the annals of movie titles, so i guess at least they’re consistent in their lack of imagination)

  98. IOv3 says:

    Leah, I am still not convinced it’s going to be THE DARK KNIGHT RISES. I keep thinking that it’s a temp title that they will change at Comic-Con this year.

  99. leahnz says:

    let’s hope so, for the sake of all that is good and holy. i can’t even say ‘the dark knight rises’ out loud without snickering/cringing slightly.

  100. movieman says:

    Not sure whether this is the blog thread for it, although it is BYOB, right?
    There were several comments about Emma Stone on an earlier thread, so here goes:
    let’s all pray that she doesn’t grow up to become another irritatingly mannered, faux-hipster-boho chick like Zooey Deschanel.
    (And Emma fans will want to check her out in the barely released, just-out-on-dvd “Paper Man.” Nice little movie, and Stone is terrific.)

  101. yancyskancy says:

    I like Zooey, but Emma has shown more energy in any random moment of screen time than Zooey has projected in 10 years. And I don’t see anything faux-hipster-boho about her at all. Whether her particular quirks wear well is impossible to predict of course. Familiarity breeds contempt, and all that. But right now, I’m in the Emma can do no wrong camp.

  102. leahnz says:

    emma – who’s channelling a young jodie foster in a big way, her features, her voice, her laugh – is terrific in everything.

    i was comatose on the couch the other night watching cable and channel-surfed onto some bland matthew mccaunahowyouspellit movie, and this amusing super-goofy ultra-frizzy-haired brace-mouthed be-freckled dorky teen girl role caught my eye and held my attention – a stand-out bright spot amidst the dullery – and i kept thinking, “who is that girl? she’s great”, and then i realised it was emma, who barely looked herself. i watched most of the movie just to see emma do her thing (the movie as it turns out was ‘ghosts of girlfriends past’, which i’d never heard of before that day. emma plays the teen ghost who leads the deadly dull matthew on his journey of self discovery a la ‘a christmas carol’)

    oh, edited to say, weirdly michael douglas is also in that movie, in a rather hilarious little turn as the uncle/surrogate father/extremely poor role model to matthew’s lead. v bizarre.

  103. IOv3 says:

    Movieman, listen to this… and then get back to me with that silly fucking comment. Bashing Zooey D? Someone needs to cut… that… shit… out.

  104. hcat says:

    Sanj’s reality show star Batman idea is awful, but I would like to see, after the Nolan cycle is complete a Black and White Batman Noir set in the era when the comic debuted (Could be made on a budget). Would love to see a depression era Superman, and an early sixties Fantastic Four as well.

  105. sanj says:

    another idea i have …

    have the entire cast of Batman movie with music artists only …

    50 cent has Batman … Eminem as a bad guy ..Lady Gaga has batgirl ..

    with over 20 other muscians in other roles ..

    my ideas are awesome …i should run a movie studio

  106. Drew McWeeny says:

    Actually, iO, she is not listed as Catwoman in the press release. I don’t think there’s a bait and switch going on, but be accurate. She is only referred to as “Selina Kyle” in the press release, and the word “Catwoman” is never used.

  107. IOv3 says:

    Well I stand corrected Drew but really, not listing her as CATWOMAN is typical Nolan sneakiness. He’s a slippery one.

  108. Martin S says:

    IO – “It’s not about NAME RECOGNITION with Catwoman (she’s listed as CATWOMAN in the press release) but Catwoman being a character that has had name recognition for close to 50 years.

    Ohhhhh…well then. That makes perfect sense. It’s not about NAME RECOGNITION…it’s about name recognition. Yes. IO logic on full display.

    They know they fucked the character up with that movie with Hallie Berry and now they are going to fix it.

    Really? That’s Nolan’s motivation? A guy who never read Batman until he got the Begins job is now a mission to fix what “they” fucked up, even though he was not apart of the “they” who did the initial up-fucking. If you’re trying to imply WB inserted Catwoman into the script, you have a problem. Nolan has stated one of the reasons he came back is he’s had carte blanche over DKR because of TDK and Inception.

    Seriously, Thalia is Thalia and Catwoman is Catwoman. The fact that you are ignoring a casting notice that mentioned TWO FEMALE leads to put forth this hokey 90s silliness, is pretty astounding.

    Thalia was in and eventually out of Begins and TDK, so if they announce the second female as Thalia, then everyone will know what that means and the expectations for Liam and the Lazarus Pit will be high, (which was apart of Goyer’s original storyarc, IIRC). But if Al Ghul’s resurrection doesn’t fit with Nolan’s Batman reality, then what’s the point of Thalia? I’ve read the backlog of Al Ghul storylines, it’s consistently derivative. The same can be said about Catwoman. You can rant and rave about “50 years” because it leaves the impression of a treasure trove to work with. The truth is there’s no there, “there”, until sometime in the 80’s.

    Nolan has no problem fucking with supposed canon mythos because he works with the material that suits. Two-Face’s comic origin has no resemblance to what occurs in TDK, and Wayne doesn’t train under Ducard/Al Ghul as seen in Begins, but both work for the stories he wanted to tell. If Thalia suddenly disappears from casting, then who knows.

  109. IOv3 says:

    Martin, oh my god I fucked up a sentence. Jesus H. Fucking Christ. Nevertheless, what you want is what you want, and I pretty much think what you want is shitty. I am a huge Catwoman fan and if anyone can give her her due on screen, it’s Christopher Nolan. Who, you know, knows something about Batman now.

    Jesus, you act like the guy didn’t make two of the better hero movies in the last decade. Seriously man, your idea shits upon a great character for Thalia Al Ghul. Really? Again, unless we are getting Damien in a Batman film, who the fuck needs Thalia Al Ghul when you have Catwoman? Seriously.

  110. Martin S says:

    IO – you didn’t fuck up a sentence. You fucked up a thought. The difference is my guess is based upon what’s come before, yours, like always, is pure emo.

    …and all you ever said after TDK was “Black Mask! Black Mask!”. You never once mentioned Catwoman. I tend to believe whatever choice was made, you were going to turn out to be a “huge fan”.

  111. IOv3 says:

    Martin, go back and read my comments about that film because anyone who knows anything about Nolan, knew Catwoman would be in this film. Seriously, you don’t have Lucius state the Bat suit will WORK WELL AGAINST CATS and not have people who know have a peaked interest about Catwoman. I am sure that I brought it up at least once on this blog, or the old blog actually, but if I did not. I did in real life because I LOVE FUCKING CATWOMAN!

    The fact that you think I would be excited no matter what, demonstrates why there can be some serious motherfucking assholes on this blog. Have you read anything about Bane from me? Hell no. Why? Outside of a great storyline on THE BATMAN three or four years ago, Bane has been rather shitty in the comics. Hell, I mentioned Black Mask because Black Mask fits a lot better than Bane in the Nolan universe, but they are going to turn Hardy into a Cuban. So, yeah, I am rolling with it. Again, I am a Catwoman fan, she’s an awesome character, and it’s about time she’s getting her fucking propers in a movie.

    Finally, emo? Fuck you motherfucker :P. You going to go on about the SCENE next? Take off your fucking skinny jeans and realize that Thalia Al Ghul only has one purpose in all the Bat books now and that purpose is DAMIEN.

    Damien is AWESOME as ROBIN. WE are not going to get a ROBIN in these films so why they fuck introduce her? Who gives a shit about Ra’s or anything associated with him, when this is the last Batman film?

    Seriously, your entire post is nothing but… EMO… because it’s not going on about what happened in Begins or TDK, it’s going on about what happened in THE BACKGROUND BEFORE WITH THE PREVIOUS TWO FILMS. Wow, she was in the script, not in the film, who gives a fuck? You want what you want but the fact that you think what you want means more than what’s happening, is typical geek bullshit. EMO? Go listen to ALL TIME LOW and have a nice fucking day.

  112. Joe Leydon says:

    I am ridiculously proud to report that one of my former students — Lucas Mireles — is premiering a short this weekend at the Slamdance Film Festival!

  113. leahnz says:

    “Nolan has no problem fucking with supposed canon mythos because he works with the material that suits. Two-Face’s comic origin has no resemblance to what occurs in TDK, and Wayne doesn’t train under Ducard/Al Ghul as seen in Begins, but both work for the stories he wanted to tell.”

    that’s a stretch, martin s. i said nolan hasn’t significantly departed from the comic characters in form and function, and he hasn’t.

    ras al ghul in character and function in ‘begins’ is exactly as he appears in comic lore, an environmental terrorist wanting to restore ‘balance’ to a corrupt, out-of-whack system/world; that nolan created a wayne/al ghul backstory/relationship in no way alters al ghul’s character for the film, his function exactly the same as in the comics.

    as for harvey dent, he starts out as district attorney and an ally of the bat just as in comic lore; the circumstances of how his face is ruined and he becomes two-face are different in TDK, yes, but this does not change the nature of the dent/two-face character, of whom we see little of in TDK with his story so severely truncated anyway.

    i think using these examples in saying “Nolan has no problem fucking with supposed canon mythos” to support a ‘selena will be talia’ theory is thin at best. the nolan flicks have remained largely faithful to the comic characters without significant departure in either function or form from their roots, only changing circumstance/setting. there’s little precedent for the notion that nolan will now suddenly serious fuck with canon and condense/merge the extremely iconic character of selena kyle with talia to suit his needs, changing the very nature of their chararacters in the process. this would be a huge departure from authentic batman lore, something nolan has avoided thus far anyway in his modern take on the bat.

    (congrats to your boy, joe, you sound like a proud papa)

  114. cadavra says:

    Movieman: Yikes! I really did type MGM, didn’t I? Too mucha dat wacky terbacky, I guess. Your clarification makes perfect sense, but IMHO, I thought she was well-cast in all of them (or, in the case of MAMMA, managed to rise above the dreadful material better than most others could have). Name another actress who could’ve channeled Julia Child so well, and as for DOUBT: she sure scared the shit outta me, and I’m Jewish!

  115. toprid bunny says:

    Does David do top 10s or end of year commentary or anything like that? Maybe I missed it. I’d be interested to see his thoughts.

  116. movieman says:

    Cad- I think it’s Streep’s tendency to go “cutesy” too often these days
    that rankles me. In “Mamma Mia!,” “Prairie Home Companion,” “Complicated,” even “Angels in America,” Streep drove me up the wall with her “look-how-adorable-I-am?” affectations. And her overweening “New Yawk” accent in “Doubt” only contributed to an irritatingly
    mannered performance that was already over-the-top, particularly in comparison with Hoffman, Adams and Davis’ beautifully modulated (and infinitely subtle) work. Not sure if you had the chance to see Jones do the role on B’way, but she was sublime.
    As stated previously, I adored Streep in “Prada” and “J&J,” but too many of her recent choices–and perfs–have baffled and annoyed me.
    I miss Michelle Pfeiffer, Jessica Lange and all of those other wonderful “mature” actresses we almost never see anymore. As for Streep, I feel like I’m seeing too much of her; and in too many of the wrong movies.
    Of course, in comparison with the bored, indifferent, phoning-it-in stuff her “Falling in Love” costar is doing these days (and in vastly inferior films), Streep still looks golden by comparison. “Mamma Mia” may have been crap, but it was still better crap than, say, “Righteous Kill,” “City by the Sea,” “Showtime,” “The Godsend” or “15 Minutes.”
    Blaming her for taking all of the plum 50+ actress roles available was a tad unfair of me, I suppose. The real fault-as I previously mentioned– lies with the unimaginative studio heads and producers who (apparently) don’t know any other (mature) actresses besides La Meryl.

  117. hcat says:

    Please add Frances McDormand’s name to the list of criminally underused actresses over 50.

    You know what would have been a plum role for Pfeiffer. The love interest in RED. She’s played opposite Willis before, could have easily handled the part, but they went with someone 15 years his junior. Those are the type of pairings that are putting older actresses out of work.

  118. Geoff says:

    Hcat, I see your point about Red, but honestly I don’t think many would have bought Pfeiffer as a lonely call center employee. Almost as much of a stretch as……a lonely waitress.

  119. Geoff says:

    You know, I didn’t realize that Frances McDormand was in her ’50’s – wow, seems like she got a later start than others. The earliest I remember her was in Darkman in 1990 – so she was in her ’30’s even when she was doing pure ingenue roles, interesting.

    And honestly, it seems to me that Gwyneth Paltrow and Halle Berry have been around way longer than her – sick of both of them, by now.

  120. hcat says:

    Blood Simple was 84 and she bounced around television in between movie roles in her husband’s films (and his friends, Raimi and the Coens were buds back in the day, I think the Coens cowrote Crimewave with him, which is probably how she got the role in Darkman). She’s an incredible actress and quite versitle but sadly not enough of a box office draw to command big films. Much like another Coen alum Marcia Gay Harden who is consistently magnificent but not given enough to do.

  121. cadavra says:

    For the record, when RED was filmed, Willis was 54 and Parker was 45. That’s reasonably age-appropriate.

  122. IOv3 says:

    Once they hired that new centrist douche president of MSNBC two years ago, who had a problem with progressives being angry with conservatives, the writing was on the wall. The funny thing is that Keith can basically do what he wants to do on the net, slam FOX news and all of the scum REPCONS, and probably have roughly the same audience.

    What really pisses me off is that they did not let Rachel take over for Keith. I love Lawrence but he’s no Rachel in terms of the doing that Countdown format.

  123. Foamy Squirrel says:

    Grats Joe. Does this mean you’ve got a hotline to Redford? 😉

  124. Joe Leydon says:

    Of course I do. Robert Redford knows who I am. I’m the guy who liked Havana and The Great Gatsby.

  125. Maybe MSNBC got a memo indicating that Olbermann would would be a “difficult public face for NBC in a time of corporate merger”.

  126. IOv3 says:

    Apparently Keith went over to Comcast and said; “You and I, we’re done.” The fact that they had a problem with their biggest host and the face of their network, demonstrates why COMCAST are just plain… stupid.

  127. cadavra says:

    IO: “Countdown” is history. O’Donnell is simply moving his show into Keith’s slot.

    This really isn’t much of a surprise. Keith and MSNBC President Phil Griffin have loathed each other for years, and the latter has never made a secret of his desire to get rid of the host. Moreover, this isn’t the first time the network has axed its highest-rated show: in 2002, Phil Donahue got shitcanned for not toeing the company line in pushing for the impending invasion of Iraq. My guess is they got rid of Keith BEFORE the merger to spare Comcast the problem of getting rid of him without making it look like a political move. Either way, we’re all losers today, as Fox, Rush, Breitbart and the rest will be completely uncontrollable now.

  128. IOv3 says:

    Cad, he doesn’t have to be on TV to still have a voice.

  129. Foamy Squirrel says:

    Joe – you’re THAT guy? And you admit it?

  130. sanj says:

    Keith Olbermann will just end up on Fox …he just has to crank up the crazy by 50% ..he can totally get help by that
    crazy Glen Beck guy .

  131. hcat says:

    “Either way, we’re all losers today, as Fox, Rush, Breitbart and the rest will be completely uncontrollable now”

    Olbermann did nothing to reign in those guys. I agree people will miss him but as far as watchdog of the media or whatever he was trying to do by constantly calling out the other side, its not like it accomplished anything. And I say this as part of the choir he was preaching to.

    And since being on the air Maddow is the public face of MSNBC, she probably gets better ratings in her time slot so thats why their not moving her.

  132. hcat says:

    And IO, a few days earlier in Threadzilla here, weren’t you praising Comcast?

  133. IOv3 says:

    No, I was stating the dude who ran NBC now comes from Comcast, and he’s not a complete fucking idiot. That aside, the face of MSNBC has been Keith for close to 8 years. There is no Rachel or Lawrence on that network without the time they subbed for Keith. Maddow’s ratings are okay but they are no where near the HIGHEST RATED NEWS SHOW OUTSIDE OF PROPAGANDA NETWORK EL FOX! That’s what MSNBC lost last night and without giving Rachel that show, they will continue to lose more and more audience.

    Now you going on about how he did nothing to REIN in those guys, is sort of bullshit. He did more to rein in those guys than anyone ever has, but we live in a stupid a country. A stupid backward ass country that believes both sides are equally as bad, and that leads to those guys getting away with shit based on that logical fallacy. The fact that you think nothing was accomplished by calling these people out on their bullshit, is pretty fucking sad.

  134. christian says:

    “my ideas are awesome …i should run a movie studio”

    With those ideas, you might get there.

  135. Martin S says:

    Leah – ras al ghul in character and function in ‘begins’ is exactly as he appears in comic lore, an environmental terrorist wanting to restore ‘balance’ to a corrupt, out-of-whack system/world; that nolan created a wayne/al ghul backstory/relationship in no way alters al ghul’s character for the film, his function exactly the same as in the comics.

    That eco-slant of Ras didn’t come about until the late 90’s. For about 25 years, he was an Arabic hybrid of Moriarty and Dracula. Their entire relationship was predicated on the idea that Batman’s reputation made him a possible suitor for Thalia. So the form and function of Ras in Begins is diametrical from the comic. In the book, Batman had to already exist for Ras to enter his life, placing Thalia as the linchpin. In the movie, Ra’s accidentally helps create Batman by killing his parents and then providing the abilities, with the linchpin now Gotham.

    As for Dent, it’s a lot more complicated because of how he was used in TDK. The relationship with Wayne is close, but the love triangle, creating Two-Face, makes it way more intimate than it ever was in the comic. TDK turns Two-Face into a sociopath looking for personal revenge. In the comic, he’s mainly been a crime boss who’s unpredictable actions have let Batman escape alive, but also created Robin since he arbitrarily killed his parents.

    The point is comics as a source material are a double-edged sword. On one hand, the writers have a massive library to work with, but on the other, most of the interpretations are soap opera. Storyarcs do not evolve after decades, so the screen writers have to find characters with elements that fit their overall theme, if it has a theme.

    So look at the characters mentioned as being associated with DKR…

    Selina Kyle, Bane, Hugo Strange, Ras, Thalia.

    ..and the LCD is that they all deduced Wayne is Batman. Revelation as the identity theme. As for escalation, Nolan has taken the final confrontation from Burton’s Batman, (when Batman and Joker are arguing about who created who first), and expanded the idea into a kind of chaos theory.

    In Begins, Ducard reveals to Wayne his true identity as Ras and then destroys Wayne Manor. In DKR, it appears we’re going to see the escalation of that scene with Bane & possibly Thalia replacing Ras, and Gotham replacing Wayne Manor. It’s why I tend to believe Thalia cannot appear to be herself or in open league with Bane as it’s too directly confrontational.

    I could easily be wrong, especially when I read the comments about the secondary status Nolan has given his female characters. Thalia could be used like a female Bond villain, but Catwoman has always been the Pussy Galore model. I’m also beginning to wonder if one of the two do not end up as Lady Shiva.

Quote Unquotesee all »

It shows how out of it I was in trying to be in it, acknowledging that I was out of it to myself, and then thinking, “Okay, how do I stop being out of it? Well, I get some legitimate illogical narrative ideas” — some novel, you know?

So I decided on three writers that I might be able to option their material and get some producer, or myself as producer, and then get some writer to do a screenplay on it, and maybe make a movie.

And so the three projects were “Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep,” “Naked Lunch” and a collection of Bukowski. Which, in 1975, forget it — I mean, that was nuts. Hollywood would not touch any of that, but I was looking for something commercial, and I thought that all of these things were coming.

There would be no Blade Runner if there was no Ray Bradbury. I couldn’t find Philip K. Dick. His agent didn’t even know where he was. And so I gave up.

I was walking down the street and I ran into Bradbury — he directed a play that I was going to do as an actor, so we know each other, but he yelled “hi” — and I’d forgot who he was.

So at my girlfriend Barbara Hershey’s urging — I was with her at that moment — she said, “Talk to him! That guy really wants to talk to you,” and I said “No, fuck him,” and keep walking.

But then I did, and then I realized who it was, and I thought, “Wait, he’s in that realm, maybe he knows Philip K. Dick.” I said, “You know a guy named—” “Yeah, sure — you want his phone number?”

My friend paid my rent for a year while I wrote, because it turned out we couldn’t get a writer. My friends kept on me about, well, if you can’t get a writer, then you write.”
~ Hampton Fancher

“That was the most disappointing thing to me in how this thing was played. Is that I’m on the phone with you now, after all that’s been said, and the fundamental distinction between what James is dealing with in these other cases is not actually brought to the fore. The fundamental difference is that James Franco didn’t seek to use his position to have sex with anyone. There’s not a case of that. He wasn’t using his position or status to try to solicit a sexual favor from anyone. If he had — if that were what the accusation involved — the show would not have gone on. We would have folded up shop and we would have not completed the show. Because then it would have been the same as Harvey Weinstein, or Les Moonves, or any of these cases that are fundamental to this new paradigm. Did you not notice that? Why did you not notice that? Is that not something notable to say, journalistically? Because nobody could find the voice to say it. I’m not just being rhetorical. Why is it that you and the other critics, none of you could find the voice to say, “You know, it’s not this, it’s that”? Because — let me go on and speak further to this. If you go back to the L.A. Times piece, that’s what it lacked. That’s what they were not able to deliver. The one example in the five that involved an issue of a sexual act was between James and a woman he was dating, who he was not working with. There was no professional dynamic in any capacity.

~ David Simon