A COMMENTER INSPIRES A NEW ENTRY…
Dave – did you comment on this followup article about DEEP THROAT’S b/o numbers by Fenton and Co? Personally I’m siding with Michael Hiltzik on this one. Fenton and Co take some singular data and then apply it as a universal rule. Bean counters, these guys aint.
Posted by: jeffrey boam’s doctor | March 8, 2005 12:21 PM
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It shows how out of it I was in trying to be in it, acknowledging that I was out of it to myself, and then thinking, “Okay, how do I stop being out of it? Well, I get some legitimate illogical narrative ideas” ā some novel, you know?
So I decided on three writers that I might be able to option their material and get some producer, or myself as producer, and then get some writer to do a screenplay on it, and maybe make a movie.
And so the three projects were “Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep,” “Naked Lunch” and a collection of Bukowski. Which, in 1975, forget it ā I mean, that was nuts. Hollywood would not touch any of that, but I was looking for something commercial, and I thought that all of these things were coming.
There would be no Blade Runner if there was no Ray Bradbury. I couldn’t find Philip K. Dick. His agent didn’t even know where he was. And so I gave up.
I was walking down the street and I ran into Bradbury ā he directed a play that I was going to do as an actor, so we know each other, but he yelled “hi” ā and I’d forgot who he was.
So at my girlfriend Barbara Hershey’s urging ā I was with her at that moment ā she said, “Talk to him! That guy really wants to talk to you,” and I said “No, fuck him,” and keep walking.
But then I did, and then I realized who it was, and I thought, “Wait, he’s in that realm, maybe he knows Philip K. Dick.” I said, “You know a guy namedā” “Yeah, sure ā you want his phone number?”
My friend paid my rent for a year while I wrote, because it turned out we couldn’t get a writer. My friends kept on me about, well, if you can’t get a writer, then you write.”
~ Hampton Fancher
“That was the most disappointing thing to me in how this thing was played. Is that Iām on the phone with you now, after all thatās been said, and the fundamental distinction between what James is dealing with in these other cases is not actually brought to the fore. The fundamental difference is that James Franco didnāt seek to use his position to have sex with anyone. Thereās not a case of that. He wasnāt using his position or status to try to solicit a sexual favor from anyone. If he had ā if that were what the accusation involved ā the show would not have gone on. We would have folded up shop and we would have not completed the show. Because then it would have been the same as Harvey Weinstein, or Les Moonves, or any of these cases that are fundamental to this new paradigm. Did you not notice that? Why did you not notice that? Is that not something notable to say, journalistically? Because nobody could find the voice to say it. Iām not just being rhetorical. Why is it that you and the other critics, none of you could find the voice to say, āYou know, itās not this, itās thatā? Because ā let me go on and speak further to this. If you go back to the L.A. TimesĀ piece, thatās what it lacked. Thatās what they were not able to deliver. The one example in the five that involved an issue of a sexual act was between James and a woman he was dating, who he was not working with. There was no professional dynamic in any capacity.
~ David Simon
I have to side with Fenton and Barbato: Hiltzik’s calculations are undermined by his failure to allow for jacked-up admission prices (in want of a better term) at XXX-rated theaters in the 1970s. A ticket to a porn film could run as high as $10 at a time when average price for mainstream movie tickets hovered at just under $3. And yes, before you ask: I did buy a few of those overpriced tickets. Hell, I remember seeing “Mona, The Virgin Nymph,” a movie the predated “Deep Throat” by several months with a suspiciously similar plot. (I think the guys who made it went on to make “Flesh Gordon.”)
Joe – Lets just say Bill Osco is on my speed dial Joe š And even though ticket prices for THROAT may have been jacked ($10?!?!) in some areas, the few theatres I saw it playing at were for a coupla bucks. Remember its in the filmmakers best interests to elevate the porno-chic era into the stratosphere… yes it was hugely influential, don’t get me wrong but so much of it was confined to small pockets and hip crossovers. There’s another indie that beats THROAT.. but you’ll have to wait for my book š By the way.. anyone read the fantastic recent book by Legs McNeil; The Oral history of Porn?
I also say categorically it wasn’t playing at 70 theatres IN THE SAME WEEK EVER. And the theatres where it pulled in $100k in 2 weeks were EXCEPTIONS to the rule. And even those figures are questionable… you breakdown a $100k in patrons for that period and sessions! Also there Int’l figures are waaaay off.
All fudgy accounting. Both are trying to make themselves look better. We need independent colloboration.
Mark: Unfortunately, I don’t think we’ll ever get independent collaboration. I suspect it’s kinda-sorta like, of all things, “Birth of a Nation.” There are some film historians who argue (quite peruasively) that it sold more tickets than any other movie in all of history — but because it was released during a time when box-office accounting was in its infancy, we’ll never know for sure.
Jeff: All I can say is, I remember some XXX houses in New Orleans (where I grew up) charging as much as $10 in the ’70s. Of course — and this isn’t a joke — I wouldn’t be surprised if the admission price had to be that high to cover legal expenses, because the theaters were raided by the cops on a regular basis.
Ever Fenton & Barbato are soaking their letter with b-s calculations or the other guy just blushed like a virgin for he couldn’t imagine b-o figures that high with his butt stuck on the reformatory school bench.
Guess who i’m siding with.
tell them they owe me for my time and suffering with party monster
The easiest conclusion that the filmmakers are full of shait was made in the original article. If the film sold THAT many VHS tapes then there would be copies that show up on ebay. I made an extremely low budget film in 1985- we sold only like 15,000 tapes- and one shows up on ebay monthly.
So we go look and find out that only an Xfiles episode called Deep Throat is named that.
I call Bull shit.
[Mark Baby- you meant Corroboration, but we get it]
[Bicycle Bob- you’re a douche. Not for anything specific- you just are]
I really do not like reading your nonsense posts Mr Dooley. So I think I will stop. You’re all talk and a lot of hot air.
Bill Kelly, the fed who worked on the case claims bags of $200k were being exchanged from cinemas, this is corroborated by the pickup man from Mickey Z who was capo to the original backers, Butchie Peraino. These stand over tactics of mob heavies counting patrons at theatres backfired according to roadshow king Dave Friedman who claims they were easily bribed by the saavy exhibitors. He thinks the mob only got 50% of what they should have collected. No one disputes a whole lot of money came in from THROAT. However the FBI claim that the Mickey Z mob possibly made even more from TEXAS CHAIN SAW as one of their Bryanston distribution titles, which was released wider and had longer legs for all ancillaries. Where did all the money go?
Well (did Elmore Leonard rip this?) Hollywood proved to the mob that when it comes to dirty dealing, those sleep-with-the-fishes, concrete-shoe-fitting boys don’t know nothing. They got royally fucked in the ass by denizens of the glitterdome over many projects once they decided to produce features.
(I haven’t seen doco so not sure how much of this is old news)
dooley if u were worth the effort i’d get into it with u. but u don’t even have anything clever to contribute or have a point. ur like a 12 yr old who gets picked on too much by the bullies
Spam, learn to spell “always” right before you correct others. Thanks, guy.
To my best knowledge, ebay have a policy of selling non porn products. Thats your reason. And who says ebay is the way to track VHS sales? That’s just stupid.
To- all the retards of the board
1- EBAY has an adult section. They just do. As a child maybe you cannot get in?
2- Ebay is not how you track sales, baboon. Let me type slowly for you- “if they really sold that many VHS of the film somebody would be selling one even if it was only for $10.”
3- Mark- always is always forever. Now go eat shit.
4- Bicycle douche- I AM worth the effort and so is the English language. You are not ee cummings. You are a douche.
5- Terry- One man’s hot air is another man’s farts. Suck mine.
Kisses.
Too much raging… please tone it down…