Watching The Watchmen Bottom Line
The question has been floating around for a while…
Once we got past the very real drama of Fox
May 17, 2024
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It shows how out of it I was in trying to be in it, acknowledging that I was out of it to myself, and then thinking, “Okay, how do I stop being out of it? Well, I get some legitimate illogical narrative ideas” — some novel, you know?
So I decided on three writers that I might be able to option their material and get some producer, or myself as producer, and then get some writer to do a screenplay on it, and maybe make a movie.
And so the three projects were “Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep,” “Naked Lunch” and a collection of Bukowski. Which, in 1975, forget it — I mean, that was nuts. Hollywood would not touch any of that, but I was looking for something commercial, and I thought that all of these things were coming.
There would be no Blade Runner if there was no Ray Bradbury. I couldn’t find Philip K. Dick. His agent didn’t even know where he was. And so I gave up.
I was walking down the street and I ran into Bradbury — he directed a play that I was going to do as an actor, so we know each other, but he yelled “hi” — and I’d forgot who he was.
So at my girlfriend Barbara Hershey’s urging — I was with her at that moment — she said, “Talk to him! That guy really wants to talk to you,” and I said “No, fuck him,” and keep walking.
But then I did, and then I realized who it was, and I thought, “Wait, he’s in that realm, maybe he knows Philip K. Dick.” I said, “You know a guy named—” “Yeah, sure — you want his phone number?”
My friend paid my rent for a year while I wrote, because it turned out we couldn’t get a writer. My friends kept on me about, well, if you can’t get a writer, then you write.”
~ Hampton Fancher
“That was the most disappointing thing to me in how this thing was played. Is that I’m on the phone with you now, after all that’s been said, and the fundamental distinction between what James is dealing with in these other cases is not actually brought to the fore. The fundamental difference is that James Franco didn’t seek to use his position to have sex with anyone. There’s not a case of that. He wasn’t using his position or status to try to solicit a sexual favor from anyone. If he had — if that were what the accusation involved — the show would not have gone on. We would have folded up shop and we would have not completed the show. Because then it would have been the same as Harvey Weinstein, or Les Moonves, or any of these cases that are fundamental to this new paradigm. Did you not notice that? Why did you not notice that? Is that not something notable to say, journalistically? Because nobody could find the voice to say it. I’m not just being rhetorical. Why is it that you and the other critics, none of you could find the voice to say, “You know, it’s not this, it’s that”? Because — let me go on and speak further to this. If you go back to the L.A. Times piece, that’s what it lacked. That’s what they were not able to deliver. The one example in the five that involved an issue of a sexual act was between James and a woman he was dating, who he was not working with. There was no professional dynamic in any capacity.
~ David Simon
I don’t really care whether the film makes money or not. I’m sure it will. I’ll be there becsuse I read the comic when I was growing up and loved the story and still do.
All the changes made don’t bode well for my tastes.
Snyder isn’t much of a filmmaker to me. Too much slo-mo.
Still hoping.
Yep, The Watchmen WILL definitely make money. But will the film hold up? Who knows? I’m not holding my breath for this.
who is eric kohn? where else have you seen negative stuff about the film?
i know you don’t like geeks or this genre, but this is weak, weak, weak.
I’m very skeptical, and have been. The trailer wowed some, has not won me over. The main reason is that 300 wasn’t a movie so much as a video game and I having not read the graphic novel, no clue on what the hell this movie is about or what it is saying.
And WB just released their outdoor campaign all over LA. And those billboards SUCK.
Anyone else think each successive trailer has been worse?
I *loved* the moody first one with the Smashing Pumpkins song; The second showed more footage but was much less atmospheric.
The current trailer, which I saw twice this weekend, seemed strangley clunky and small-scale, and has this depressing song with a Queen-like Brian May guitar that plays some whiny riff toward the end, and it actually got some pretty bad laughs in a packed house.
What is that horrible song?
“Anyway
Very weak. You’re ignoring the other, very positive responses to the opening 18 minutes, including my own from December. In fact, that link was the first negative reaction I’ve read or heard. And I’ve spoken to a number of people who have seen the film and response has been uniformly positive.
This film will screen, even if you’re not counting the upcoming junket screenings.
Lex and Hop: go watch the Japanese trailer. It seems to sum up what the movie is about better than the American trailers.
Winston: Word up, sir. Word up.
Actually, a lot of geek like geek movies and not a whole lot else. IO, I only remember you passionately writing about movies if they have guys in capes or metal suits on. I could be wrong, but I don’t ever recall reading a long winded incoherent rant by you over, say, The Reader.
I also thought the first trailer for Watchmen was great, and after that…eh. I’ll still check it out though. It’d be nice if Snyder would cut the slo-mo out and then the movie could be two hours long.
Carlito: I have 1000 DVDs. Are there that many fucking Superhero films? I think not. Hold on. I forgot to count all of those Turkish films. Damn it! Okay. So there are over 1000 superhero films including Turkey, but I love all sorts of film.
If you were here last year. You would read me defending Michael Clayton like crazy. Heck. I could watch any number of films from any type of genre all the live long day.
I simply defend most of those films here, because no one else does. I love these films, and refuse to let someone post WEAK ASS BULLSHIT about them like David does on a regular fucking basis.
Poland, you pride yourself on being a serious journalist? With regard to a Watchmen screening schedule and reactions to the film and it’s first 18 minutes you are wildly misinformed. The shit you’re shoveling here is the very definition of gossip.
“And the few who have actually seen the film
IO, what’s your opinion on Harry Knowles?
I don’t think it’s weak, I’m hearing the same rumblings that David is. I know 3-4 people who have seen it and one of them a tried and true geek didn’t like it. I wasn’t that impressed with that newer-and finished of 20 minutes of footage that I saw either. Now I’m not saying it’s crap, I dunno, but I’m not feeling these dismissals either. They strike me as coming from fanboy enthusiasts who don’t like to hear anything but rah rah rah, which is typical.
Up with this I will not put.
“The women of the film, especially in age make-up
i’m seeing it a week from tomorrow…seems like enough time to me…..
Lots of gossip just strewn about this piece……
IOI, I’ll bite, would you tell us how many of your 1000 DVD are Turkish, and with a title or two?
Lex, since no one answered your musical question, I believe that second trailer had Phillip Glass segueing into a song by Radiohead wannabes Muse.
I haven’t disliked either of the domestic trailers, but both left me wondering how people who haven’t read it were supposed to know what the fuck was going on.
They really need to cut a more “story” based trailer that’s not focused so much on the whizz-bang stuff. Because all the average person is going to take away is actors they don’t know running around in silly costumes. And that way lies Mystery Men, not Fantastic Four.
Oh drama.
“i know you don’t like geeks or this genre”
“Wildly misinformed. The shit you’re shoveling here is the very definition of gossip.
“So all the female cast members are no good in this film? Nice.”
“Warner Brothers deliberately burns kittens and harvests the remains to eat in front of starving orphans, and that Rothman is actually Jesus back on Earth”
Please. Just because IO screams bloody murder because I don’t think The Dark Knight is the perfect movie doesn’t make any of this true.
I am fine with geeks and have been as supportive of this genre as anyone.
I never said that geeks will be distracted by Ms. Ackerman’s ass… but the intense love of well replicated comic books that don’t really work as films cannot be denied.
There are two major female roles in the film, mother and daughter. CC is supposed to be fine playing her age and look horrible in the age make-up, taking people out of the film.
WB is no more evil than Fox or anyone else. They aren’t Jesus walking either. I have no problem with the studio giving a filmmaker that made them a lot of money the freedom to do another film as he sees fit. But as Bryan Singer proved, it doesn’t always work. I hope it does here.
And I NEVER said that Dark Knight wouldn’t make money. Even when I was estimating it doing slightly better than Batman Begins, I said it would make money. So don’t go creating mythologies.
I am perfectly happy to be disagreed with, but let’s not go so far beyond what I wrote to try to devalue my opinion. It’s unnecessary.
Jeff: I was being intentionally facetious. Most of them consist of TV shows, classic films, and the Armatage two-pack. Who does not love some ARMATAGE?
Roman: I am not trying to stir the shit, but what’s your opinion on Devin Farci? He drives me nuts, but I like the guy’s writing. Few things are funnier than their cynicism.
My thoughts on Headgeek: he’s a guy who parlayed his tiny site into a freakin “tentpole” of geekdom online. It’s a place to go, his DVDs reviews are awesome, and his wife has great taste in music.
Besides that; he does what he does, but he really does not do much anymore. It’s basically Merrick running the film side, and Hercules running the TV side. Herc being one of the better TV people on the net, and I will always appreciate the hell out of AICN for giving him a job.
Nevertheless; Harry does what he does, and he does it the way he chooses to do it. Would I always have done it or would I do it his way? Probably not, but he’s where he’s at for a reason. Rather people like it or not.
P.S. I have liked all the trailers that I’ve seen. It will look great. But 2:40 is a real challenge for any film. And for a basic detective story set in hardcore genre, it is an even bigger challenge.
I truly hope the film is great.
What’s Armatage?
DP, you mean ‘CG’, not ‘CC’.
David: come the fuck on man. It’s one thing if we cannot prove our stances, but we CAN PROVE OUR STANCES. I am not alone with my feelings about your opinions towards geeks, Warners, and comic book films in general. It’s well-known, sir. WE can use the SEARCH ENGINE to pull it up.
So do not shit in my mouth, and call it ice cream. Admit how you feel for once. This entire thread is a fucking hit-piece. You are going for this film’s knees like you went for The Dark Knight’s knees. How that work out for you?
Jeff: if you see the ART OF WATCHMEN book. Carla’s make-up is not that disconcerting. David is once again trying to shit on something, then is going on about him not trying to shit on something. This makes him a rather interesting fucking fellow to read on a daily basis.
It’s Armitage, and here’s a link: http://www.amazon.com/Armitage-Dual-Matrix-Third-Poly-Matrix/dp/B00006674T/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1234235998&sr=1-5
i rue the release of ‘watchmen’ because it’s going to be another year of io screaming at everybody who doesn’t like it…
io — ignore this post…it wasn’t for you…please don’t respond…..
Now responding for me. Alex Rodriguez. A-Rod; “WHAT THE FUCK IS THAT ABOUT? SERIOUSLY? A VICIOUS AND HEARTLESS ATTACK! I was given a quarter of a billion dollars. I HAD TO DO SOMETHING! If I could have used bionic implants. I WOULD HAVE USED BIONIC IMPLANTS! 252m MAN! COME ON!
Also; the responses to Iron Man and The Dark Knight were straight out of Wichita, Kansas. Did you read Poland’s review of Iron Man? The discussion thread that followed up that review? Come on. Ridiculous, man. Ridiculous like RELEASING SEALED FUCKING DRUG TEST! Fuck you Bud Selig. Fuck you and your daughter. That’s right: I’m going for blood. A-Rod… out.
Time to call Maddie, and see what the hell is going on with this Brazilian model bullshit?”
IO – You expose yourself as myopic and wrong.
I didn’t go for Dark Knight’s knees… I was just not as enthusiastic as you. It is when people like you, who are often smart, act like absolute idiotic 3 year olds who need to have everything your way and if anyone disagrees with you, they are EVIL and ANGRY and shitting in your mouth.
The same is true for your “David vs The Geeks” crap. If I disagree strongly with that community 10% of the time, I HATE them and DON’T GET IT.
Oddly enough, I don’t think it’s hard to figure out with whom I actually do have serious issues. I am not shy about calling people out. But saying I hate geeks is like saying I hate black people or catholics or whatever. An offense, foolish argument, even in CAPS.
You are The Bush Administration all over… with all of the impotence and none of the military muscle.
Try a little gray in your black and white mix. You might find that you can cope with others a lot better.
Finally… I didn’t say that I have a problem with CG’s old age make-up. I said that people I have spoken to who have seen the film have problems with it. I am not unclear about where the lines are… why are you?
I SUM THE POWER OF THE ANCIENT ONE! I SUM THE POWER OF… McWEENEY STYLE!
“IO – You expose yourself as myopic and wrong.”
I’m short-sighted and wrong? Oh this is madness! Absolute madness that this guy here is claiming this of me.”
“I didn’t go for Dark Knight’s knees… I was just not as enthusiastic as you. It is when people like you, who are often smart, act like absolute idiotic 3 year olds who need to have everything your way and if anyone disagrees with you, they are EVIL and ANGRY and shitting in your mouth.”
I will once again state that I not only do not have my own blog, but I am only a poster. This limits my effectiveness as someone on this blog because I am only one man. One man who usually gets insulted and treat worse than anyone else on this blog. So, really, what power do I have? Seriously man; you went after The Dark Knight with a similar fucking piece. You wrote it right before TDK came out. Please do not act as if I am stupid, when I remember clearly you using the same tact with TDK.
“The same is true for your ‘David vs The Geeks’ crap. If I disagree strongly with that community 10% of the time, I HATE them and DON’T GET IT.”
Did you read the other people’s responses in this blog? Did you miss that? Did your invisible friend not tell you that you were being attacked from other people — WHO ARE NOT ME — on the same fucking points? Seriously David; you’ve got to be kidding me with this bullshit right now. Let’s keep reading everyone, and see if it gets any better.
“Oddly enough, I don’t think it’s hard to figure out with whom I actually do have serious issues. I am not shy about calling people out. But saying I hate geeks is like saying I hate black people or catholics or whatever. An offense, foolish argument, even in CAPS.”
If it’s not the case. WHY DOES EVERYONE THINK THAT YOU DO? It’s like your thread a month back about how people felt about you in the blogesphere. I told you then and I will repeat it now. If you are going state that you feel differently about someone, a group of people, or anything else. FUCKING WRITE AS IF YOU DO!
Do not dare give me or anyone else SHIT for calling you out on YOUR NONSENSE, when WE CAN FUCKING READ! It does not matter what you think on this blog. It matters what you type. What you have type has provided a solid case as to why you hate Warners, geeks, and genre films.
“You are The Bush Administration all over… with all of the impotence and none of the military muscle.”
Right here motherfucker. This is why you should have a lunch with me. So I can school your fucking ass on film. This is so fucking INEPT, that you deserve a smack upside the head for this comment. It’s just fucking lame. It’s so fucking lame that you would refer to a POSTER ON A BLOG to the WORST PRESIDENT EVER!
Unfortunately for you; I have know history. So you are as bad as James Buchanan in the way you let shit get out of hand on this blog, and do nothing about. You are like fucking Andrew Johnson in the way that when you interfere. You interfere in the worst way fucking possible.
“Try a little gray in your black and white mix. You might find that you can cope with others a lot better.”
This coming from the motherfucker who is downright hated and dispised by almost everyone else in his profession. Seriously, I am going to state to you this one more time, and you need to remember it: DO NOT FUCKING PLAY WITH ME POLAND. DO NOT… FUCKING… PLAY. You make Jeff seem like KRS-ONE. Jesus H. Christ. You make me laugh.
“Finally… I didn’t say that I have a problem with CG’s old age make-up. I said that people I have spoken to who have seen the film have problems with it. I am not unclear about where the lines are… why are you?”
Hold on. George Wendt from Gung-Ho. Let him know how we feel about this! “BULLLLLLLLLLLSHIT.”
You make my points beautifully, IO. Thanks.
David: you make me look more and more right each day. Thanks. Seriously: do not play. Seriously.
YES! A “McWeeny style!” AND a “do not play” in one post!!! OWN THEM, IO!
This can only mean I can take the night off as far as being obnoxious on the Hot Blog goes.
Hey lazurus, I don’t know for sure if they need a more story based trailer. Maybe they can sell the movie the same way as they did 300, purely with the visuals. Except this time they can say “From the director of 300,” which, while 300 could have because that director DID direct 300, no one had seen it so it didn’t mean what it means now, you know what I mean?
*sigh*…lex…so cruel…
“shitting in your mouth”
Hahahahahahaha.
I’ve spoken to many people who’ve seen footage, and they all, unanimously, say that they can’t wait for the movie to open, and that they are very excited about it. Not sure what your problem is Poland, but it sounds as if you’re more bothered about contractual details, as you yourself admit, “of which I do not have the details” …. For fans that is irrelevant – the content matters, and everyone at ComicCon loved it.
I think the budget is high enough that the movie needs more than the ComicCon crowd to succeed.
Most men are secretly ComicCon members, whether they attend or not … it will succeed.
I am perfectly comfortable with the idea that the ComicCon crowd and many others in their image will be very happy with the film. Not all.
Let’s not pretend that we haven’t seen 15 minutes of movies before and found out later that there was a reason for showing only those 15 minutes.
I didn’t write that in this piece because I don’t think that showing part of a movie should be an indictment. And as noted, the 15 minutes is only one thing that I find concerning. If it was just that, I would never have written a word about it.
I’m not bothered about anything… I am, as I wrote, wondering what the feelings are like out there regarding a film that has had amazing momentum, but may or may not be the movie that smells like such a big hit.
And J-Mc, in a rarity, is correct… the Geek 8 – or Geek 15 in this case – is not enough. I don’t see the campaign, so far, moving the bar. Still selling to the sold. But we’ll see. When I hear from a woman who lined up opening weekend for S&TC or a person over 50 or some other unexpected demo for this film, I will believe that it will be more than a geek cult film.
As for the quality of the movie, I will know what I feel when I see it. I will go in clean – provided I am not seeing the film after a flotilla of other reviews have launched – and no matter what IO wants to believe, and I will react to the material, not any of these other concerns.
But after being convinced that there was a huge audience waiting for this thing, I am beginning to wonder. And so I wrote this piece. And frankly, the responses seem to fit my concern. People are either all in or really ambivalent, it seems.
If you need an example of a movie that EVERYONE at ComicCon was dying to see, but didn’t go mega-bucks, just look at Hellboy 2. And that wasn’t an issue of quality. It’s not just “love it or you have some secret problem with it.” Sometimes great movies don’t sell. Sometimes crap movies sell like crazy. And then there is everything in between.
I heard some tings. I know some tings.
Advance word on many of these big budget movies leak out via the teams of paint monkeys, all who profess that the director is godlike and the film reinvents cinema. Again. They sound eerily similar to scientologists. And I know why. Do you really think they want to admit the last 18mths of their life was a waste of time? They have to believe and this is where advance buzz begins for many geek flicks. Sometimes the film pays off, often it’s just mental self-preservation.
The only opinion that really counts is your own when the lights come up.
I loved Hellboy II – watched it three times on the airplane.
dp– i am very much closer to sixty than fifty and am looking forward to this movie….i’ve also spoken with my few remaining living freinds and we all pretty much agree that we want to see it…we’re pooling resources to get batteries for our bell-tones so we won’t miss a sound….
“I simply defend most of those films here, because no one else does.”
Plenty of people defend them, it’s just that even those who do don’t place the same hyperbolic reverence of them as you do.
This looks like a bigger, more grandiose V for Vendetta. 300 had something visceral about it that grabbed people. I don’t see that quality in Watchmen. Not yet, anyway.
‘…i’ve also spoken with my few remaining living freinds and we all pretty much agree that we want to see it…we’re pooling resources to get batteries for our bell-tones so we won’t miss a sound….’
that was a hoot, scoot
what?
lmao
“And J-Mc, in a rarity, is correct… ”
Uh, thanks, DP, for the recognition, but I’m _always_ right.
And right now, I see a second weekend fall-off in the 70% range for this movie.
You can’t compare this to Hellboy 2. This is a movie based on a book that people have loved for twenty years and are finally getting to see. I don’t know if that will translate into big bucks or not. My six-year-old brother is desperate to see it and I’m desperately trying to warn his parents not to take him, but I doubt they’ll listen. He got to see Dark Knight twice.
“But saying I hate geeks is like saying I hate black people or catholics or whatever.”
David, maybe if every year you blogged about the NAACP convention or the gathering of Catholic Bishops, and complained that both were not only no fun but also just a futile attempt at marketing that won’t translate into additional sales, then that analogy would hold a bit better. That said, I ain’t mad if you have misgivings about Watchmen. So do I, and I’ve been waiting years for it.
Oh, and I just leafed through the Watchmen movie companion books today, and they confirm certain significant plot details. So just a heads-up if you want to stay spoiler-free on the changes.
Well, IO is not my favorite poster(not my least favorite either, though) but I’ve got to agree with him on this one(as well as the multiple others who spoke up earlier).
This is clearly a hit piece, written in the same passive aggressive stance that Poland has written others before. There’s always a few from Poland each year(Iron Man, There Will Be Blood, Brokeback Mountain being recent ones).
The same MO always exists, ignoring all positive indicators and heavily focusing on all negative ones, blowing the negative ones hugely out of proportion. And the frequent jabs at the films in question in unrelated or marginally related posts, so he can later claim he hasn’t written many negative posts about the film(which from his POV, he perhaps hasn’t, still the jabs accrue).
He’ll never admit it, but I too have been reading Poland since Roughcut and it’s an old story. That other readers of his don’t perceive it is mystifying, perhaps they do but agree with him in this particular instance so decide to keep quiet?
There is a reverse side to the coin, where he blindly champions a film and denigrates any negatives it accrues(Dreamgirls, Hancock, The Rundown, Speed Racer being recent examples of this).
It’s been a fairly consistent pattern as long as I’ve been reading his work. Hell I’m pretty sure I’ve posted similar comments along these lines once or twice before regarding his opinions on other movies. Old news. Say what you will about Jeff Wells, but if he doesn’t like something on a bizarre whim, he’ll own up to it, and not try and come with gimcrack proofs of why he’s right.
And seriously, if someone Poland didn’t like wrote a similarly thinly sourced article about some film he even remotely thought might be good, he’d rake them over the coals. And he’d be right to do it. Very very hypocritical.
Methinks the spin would be more favorable if this was a Sony release.
hard to speculate on a film no one has seen, much less try and bury it.
“I hope the film is good”
That doesn’t take away the amount of words you spent trying to spear this zeppelin.
PastePotPete- Good post.
My problem with DP’s blog entry is that he’s using anecdotal evidence (the opinions of a select few; the fact that they “only” showed 15 minutes of the film, etc) that confirms his preconceived notions (i.e. his “fears”, “concerns”) to effectively poison the well.
He will go in clean, he says, but based on what he’s written, I’m skeptical. I think others are too, which explains the cool reception to this blog. Many of us are now expecting an “I told you so”-type review, and no, DP, you do not know, based on the “evidence” you’re presenting.
Bagging on Poland’s for simply comparing its roll-out to other movies of similar stature is nonsense. I agree that when all is quiet on the western front there’s usually a problem, but Watchmen is a different animal. It would be impossible to keep things contained after one viewing because that information would be the equivalent to a bar of gold on the web. Show it to just one wrong person who decides to tease they’ve seen is, and WB loses the control of the campaign.
What I can agree with is that I’m not hearing the 300 momentum that I did from the non-geek college crowd. It doesn’t mean they won’t show, but it says that the same visceral response is not in play. Where Watchmen can counter that is its pedigree will bring out a ton of cinephiles who normally pass on pop-superhero fare.
Amoping up the violence quotient is not a deterrent for a Snyder film. He knows what people are expecting of him and I’m almost sure Gibbons would have depicted it if he could have gotten away with it, which he couldn’t have. The acting will be a problem. That’s a given because it part-n-parcel for Snyder.
What I’m dreading is the “TDK = Godfather 2” blather being jammed on this film so it reaches some kind of forced importance. Snyder is visually clever but he’s not cerebral like Nolan. He knows that whatever intelligence the movie has will be because of Moore and not the adaptation. If he did a Cronenberg and translated it to film, you run some big risks that might not be worth it.
OK. Firefox keeps f’ing up my posts. Anyone else run into this?
I think Dave Poland would have a more positive post up if he was granted an early screening or some other goodie. it’s how the game is played. hence his great and enthusiastic review of the classic speed racer.
Hellboy 2 is a bad analogy. I’m not sure there was ever widespread geek anticipation for Hellboy. Hellboy isn’t a well known or beloved comic, we can argue, but check the sales numbers. Hellboy is from a second tier label (anything but Marvel and DC is 2nd tier) and has only been around since 1993.
The first movie was OK, they had to switch studios to get the second off the ground and it was released during a crowded summer surrounded by big time hero properties (Hulk, Batman, and Will Smith). I’m amazed it grossed what it did. I’m a comic guy I didn’t care.
Watchmen is an genuine event. It’s a different animal.
But is Watchmen really going to be a genuine event with anyone who’s not a geek or into comic books…that’s the quetsion. But I think it’s going to open relatively big just on the basis of 300 and it looks like an action superhero movie, then people will see it and like Jeff said, it’ll have a big drop.
Martin: the Watchmen trailer turned an old dusty graphic novel into a best-seller on Amazon. It has continued since July to fly off shelves. Trust me on this one sir. It may not have some college people going crazy, but it has another constituency all it’s own. Who are clamoring for this movie. Think of them as the college crowd who wear a lot of black, have nice purple streaks in their hair, and think Rorshach is the balls.
Carlito: it sure seems possible more than geeks want to see it. Again; geeks most likely already owned the graphic novel. So it was not the geeks who made it sell like crazy. It was the other folks who wanted to know what the fuck was going. Sort of like all the nice ladies who saw Twilight, and wanted to read more about Ed Cullen.
So let me emphasize this right here and now: THIS IS NOT A GEEK FILM. THIS IS A FILM BASED ON THE MOST HERALDED GRAPHIC NOVEL OF ALL-TIME. Do you folks know how many great graphic novels have come out since 1986? This one is still considered to be the best. So stop acting as if a piece of art is geared to only geeks. When it’s obviously a piece of art that’s been turned into a movie geared towards everyone.
Poland: GEORGE WENDT! GIVE IT TO ME AG’IN! “BULLSHIT.” HB 2 opened a week before the second highest grossing film of all-time, that JUST HAPPENS TO A COMIC BOOK MOVIE! Do you not get the whole “Hey! Why see HB when we can see TDK!” BOB that happened with HB2? Seriously; there’s going to be a sequel. So your point is DOA.
I am happy at least that Triple P is another person who can see through this occasional nonsense. It’s bad enough that you think you can play, but assuming we are all idiots who do not get how you work. Well, really, that’s a total dick move on your part Poland, and I am having none of it.
Sorry, IOIOIO, graphic novels in and of themselves are geek fare plain and simple. Ask any average person on the street about Watchmen and they might be able to tell you it’s a movie coming out in a few weeks, but only a very small percentage will know or care it’s based on a graphic novel. Yes, it’s celebrated, but that doesn’t mean the audience who worships at the altar of Alan Moore is “small” (versus, say, the audience for something like Spiderman).
The only way Watchmen will match 300 worldwide will be word of mouth. Unlike 300, which had a badass trailer, it was enough to get people into the theater (despite the crapfest that turned out to be). That said, the trailers for Watchmen have garnered middling responses at best, and even the Comic Con footage hasn’t been universally raved.
I have a feeling this will do “well”, but won’t be the blockbuster WB is expecting.
Oh yeah, and with a nearly three hour runtime, this thing is going to have to sell even more screenings than 300 to make the same amount.
I assume IO dumbfuck above is referring to me as Carlito for some reason…so I’ll reply after saying his mother is a bad lay and also very ugly.
Anyway, saying that the movie is not a geek film because it’s based on a celebrated graphic novel shows just how ignorant you are. montrealkid is right, a lot of the audience going to see the movie wouldn’t know or care it was based on a comic book. Right now they do seem to be seeling to the geeks. They need to make their big play for the general audience, which I’m sure is there…although they may hate the movie since it doesn’t quite give what’s expected. No bad guy gets their ass kicked at the end, and it’s downer.
Carlito; you missed the point. Assuming a film is a geek film. Does not make it a geek film. I know it’s hard for a fat man like yourself with an afro to understand this, but that’s the truth. It’s a film. It’s only a geek film when it’s not what Watchmen has become over the last six months. Again; I am not responsible for you folks not paying attention to pop-culture. Once again it is more of a hindrance than an aid in these conversations, because you folks really do not GET how IT works.
Oh yeah Perm: you are a fat man with an afro. It’s very possible that you have not seen your penis in close to 15 years. So please refrain from even bringing up my mom. Why? YOU ARE A FAT GUY WITH AN AFRO THAT GOES BY “THE BIG PERM” online. It’s obvious you are a queen, and would rather fuck someone’s father than their mother.
Now go stick your head back up another anus. Your man must love your afrobush of a head.
I actually long for the day (coming soon!) when films stop pre screening at all. Does an MCN review mean one more ticket sold? Does what Fat Knowles types when he clears the Cheetos off his keyboard mean even one dollar more in my pocket? Au contraire, AICN violated laws in its coverage of Transformers One, wrote articles mocking the film, encouraged the caged ferrets in the talkbacks to attack the film and this led to- the film being number two worldwide that year. I urge studios to stop screening- most print media critics are gone or irrelevant already. Some online ones like Drew and Devin are great writers and terriic guys- but let they see it opening day. The online community is full of amateurs and nutjobs anyway.
As far as Watchmen is concerned, like with the MCN Oscar coverage, this analysis is I assure you more than anyone involved in the film has done. You people spend too much time thinking about things you have only partial information on.
If I were Warners, I’d be worried about one thing- having spent three long, fun days at NYC Comicon, the movie is starting to try to appeal itself to kids- and (assuming it does follow the book) with multiple rapes and dogs eating children, that’s a sure recipe for vocal parental backlash. Pretty colored heroes does NOT have to be for just kids, but you gotta be clear.
I’d agree with that. How many R-rated comic book movies are there? And most of the ones there are, like Sin City, are still kind of silly. A real adult superhero movie is a strong marketing point.
IO, if I’m fat and with an afro, what does that say about your whore mother who will still fuck me?
Remember when film lovers didn’t care about box-office marketing?
“I’d agree with that. How many R-rated comic book movies are there? And most of the ones there are, like Sin City, are still kind of silly. A real adult superhero movie is a strong marketing point.
IO, if I’m fat and with an afro, what does that say about your whore mother who will still fuck me?”
Ladies and Gentlemen! THE 1970s AFROBUSH VAGINA! Was that a person posting? No! That’s a 1970s AFROBUSH VAGINA!
1970s Afrobush Vagina: he’s a douche, but he’s also a vagina!
I guess I should just read the damn graphic novel before asking such a thing, but knowing little to nothing about the source material, is this really as “edgy” and “dark” and “subversive” as its drooling superfans keep telling me?
Or is just typical fanboy overenthusiasm mixed with a little naivete? I mean, these are the same guys who acted like the rather innocuous and obvious “V For Vendetta” was GOING TO CHANGE THE WORLD and BLOW PEOPLE’S MINDS and HAVE A PROFOUND EFFECT ON SOCIETY (was it Knowles’ embarrassing original review that posited this gasping-mouthed idiocy?)
And no one loves FIGHT CLUB more than I, but again, same thing: A lot of fanboys with that “You won’t BELIEVE how FAR this goes, IT’S SO EXTREME!” And again, SIN CITY.
All ultimately kind of fun, innocuous pop entertainments with a (rather sheltered) core contigent who act like it’s the MOST EXTREME SHIT EVER and some PERSONAL MANIFESTO.
Like, I keep hearing how FUCKING EDGY “Watchmen” is. What? Why?
Isn’t it still just a candy-ass superhero movie with pretentious overtones? Unless EVERY ONE OF THE HEROES OUT ACTIVELY TORTURING AND MASSACRING INNOCENT PEOPLE then each dying at the end, a narration full-on telling each individual audience member they are a worthless piece of shit, 27 scenes that replicate the ice-cream truck murder from PRECINCT 13, a 20-minute unwatchable IRREVERSIBLE rape, Krug and Company from LAST HOUSE humiliating young men, intercut photos of the My Lai massacre, senior citizens getting beaten ad nauseam, and closing shot of Hitler winking into the camera and muttering “It is accomplished,” nothing here could POSSIBLY live up to all this “WAIT TILL THE UNWASHED MASSES GET A LOAD OF THIS!” geek self-congratulation and faux nihilism.
(And of course it would STILL be juvenile as fuck.)
the idea that the studio isn’t pre-screening ‘watchmen’ is nonsense…there are two screenings next tuesday and more later in the week…they’re doing a full court press junket with everybody involved participating…tv, print, radio, on-line all invited….it’s business as usual…i don’t get what the fuss is…..
Lex, I see what you’re getting at, and probably the darkness/mind-blowing quotient of Watchmen has been exaggerated on some level. Certainly if you read the comic (or, I assume, watch the movie) now, in 2009, knowing little about it and having mostly heard geek hype, you would not be blown away or rattled to your core by the transgressive ultraviolence. As far as I recall from my last rereading, it’s not significantly more violent than any number of not-as-violent-as-the-hype movies.
But I think you’re taking this all a bit too literally, and maybe projecting a little onto the hype — that if people are talking it up as unfilmable/not audience-friendly/etc., then that must mean, like, close-ups of skull-raping or calls to anarchy or anything.
The book is considered “edgy” (a dumb word, but you brought it up) because of its ideas and density, not because of what happens in it. People consider it unfilmable not because it would cause a scandal, but, you know, for the main reasons lots of artsier stuff doesn’t find an audience: it’s weird, it’s downbeat, it’s morally ambiguous, and many of the characters aren’t traditionally likable. That’s it. If you read it, you might be a little underwhelmed: It’s “merely” a really, really damn good book.
I don’t think you’ll find anyone claiming Watchmen offers a PERSONAL MANIFESTO. It certainly doesn’t offer the dime-shop quasi-philosophizing Fight Club-photocopying bullshit of Wanted. Having reudced to self-congratulatory faux-nihilism is something I’m afraid of Snyder introducing (in slow-motion, of course).
That’s not to say I didn’t already buy opening night IMAX tickets, though.
Lex, once again your ability to cut through the bullshit is wonderfully refreshing. I’m a fan of Watchmen the book/graphic novel/whatever, but you’re absolutely right – it IS basically just a candy-ass superhero story with pretentious overtones. That it’s exceptionally well-written and densely animated is almost beside the point, and its naming to the Time “100 greatest novels since 1923” or whatever is bullshit – there are about a million actual novels written since then that are better.
I also think that the book is unfilmable, and that even if it can be filmed, Snyder isn’t the guy to do it. He’s not a “visionary,” he’s a capable (and sometimes less than capable – e.g. 300) genre guy, and Watchmen, even despite the overhype, requires someone who’s going to take real liberties to make it work onscreen.
Like Dave, I hope I’m wrong. Unlike Dave, I don’t have a blog, and I don’t take other people to task for prejudging a movie then essentially do it myself.
As I find myself writing responses to some of this stuff… and I’ll pass.
I remain of the opinion that arguing the issue and not the personalities is what’s interesting to me.
I am honored that so many of you – even the ones who aren’t magically in here for the first time to throw barbs – care enough to catalog my thoughts. I just wish you were a little more accurate in keeping track of the range of opinion and not just the opinions that either support or deny something you really care about. I know those are more memorable for you, but it makes for a skewed survey.
I never understood why people said Watchmen was unfilmable because of how dense it was…but they film novles all the time. Kubrick made movie after movie based on novels. Sure you cut lots of stuff out, but so what. Watchmen is entirely filmable…unless you need every single detail that’s in the comic to be in the movie, which you really don’t.
Of course novellas are the best literary form to convert to movies. They were able to make The Mist scene for scene and not lose a thing. Of Mice and Men is also a perfect length.
And Scoot… of course they are junketing. No one said they aren’t screening. For me, I can remind that I said they are screening a lot later than last time, with 300, which they have otherwise emulated.
A month out vs 2 weeks out.
Maybe it’s nothing. Maybe it’s something.
Aside from all the poo-pooing of me in here, I am reading a lot of ambivalence. That doesn’t make the movie bad or a financial failure. But it, essentially, confirms everything I was feeling that made me write this in the first place.
Everyone says it differently – which I love – but for months and months we have all covered this project as though it was a lock to be a cash cow and a game changing flick… and it may not be that. And I think that WB knows that.
My way of approaching this work is not unlike playing poker. I learn a lot more from people’s “tells” than I do from anything that comes out of their mouth. Of course, I follow up those “reads” with reporting. And then I roll it out in my own casual form.
Every time I get this particular kind of feeling, the studio response tends to be angry denial. And two weeks after the movie opens, I almost always have the conversation about how they knew they had a problem. Just becuase execs lie to the press for a living doesn’t mean they are stupid… or, in many cases, liars.
“They film novels all the time… Sure you cut lots of stuff out, but so what. Watchmen is entirely filmable…unless you need every single detail that’s in the comic to be in the movie, which you really don’t.”
With comic book movies and especially since Harry Potter, we more and more seem to have younger or more inexperienced “readers” dictacting that the movie won’t meet with their stamp of approval UNLESS every single thought, passage, aside and fucking comma is represented there on the big screen.
It reminds me of like in 6th or 7th grade when all the future rocket scientists in my class started reading the big Stephen King books, and were just SHOCKED! that the films took some liberties and shortcuts. A familiar refrain of the neophyte reader is “THEY DIDN’T EVEN SHOW THAT PART!”
It’s a telltale sign of someone who isn’t especially well-read, or at least who has a fairly narrow focus and doesn’t understand the art of interpretation or adaptation. We’ve seen it all the time the last decade or so, from geeks nitpicking superhero outfits to fake-casting their favorite characters based 100% on physical resemblance, to the “you better not fuck with my beloved shit” attitude that greets every adaptation of a young-skewing pop novel.
Never mind that, yes, directors have been adapting novels, often popular ones, for nearly a century; By today’s fanboy standards, there’d be Harper Lee fans raising a fucking ruckus over that “piece of shit movie that sucks” because Atticus’ tie was the wrong color.
‘It’s a telltale sign of someone who isn’t especially well-read, or at least who has a fairly narrow focus and doesn’t understand the art of interpretation or adaptation.’
that’s rather poncy of you, lex. i’d venture 98% of all people don’t have a good grasp of the art of film interpretation/adaptation, that doesn’t mean they aren’t well-read or narrow or silly, they just aren’t film-obsessed.
and people have been pissing and moaning about the movie adaptations of their beloved novels since year dot, but just to our friends and neighbors and workmates and anyone who is passing on the street; now with the internets, every single person and their dog (and the net skews young and geek so their voices are prevalent) can get online and gripe about book-to-film adaptations. it’s nothing new, it’s just that now we can all hear the commplaining.
dp — what you wrote was this:
“Finally, there is the lack of a screening schedule from WB at what is now a late date for a movie that is complete.”
my point was that there is/was no lack of a screening schedule and that a screening schedule has been intact for over a week…
as far as it being ‘a late date for a movie that is complete’, maybe for long-lead but it’s not unusual for broadcast or on-line (notwithstanding 300)…
and, just for the record, my original reason for posting was not to argue but just to let you know that there are screenings that you appeared not to know about (i try to limit my arguments to one a month and i think i spent mine on ‘he’s just not that into you’)……
Big Perm, I think the classification of Watchmen as “unfilmable” is as fair as saying the same thing about Ulysses. It’s not a matter of length or cutting important subplots. It’s that the material is very meta, very reflexive in the way that it’s commenting on comics while its using some of the tools native to the form to get that across. And one of these elements is the layout of the panels on the page, something that’s literally unfilmable, not to mention the little archival pieces in between each chapter and the comic-within-a-comic subtext provided by the Black Freighter mateiral (something that’s being relegated to a separate, if concurrent DVD release).
Now I’m not saying that it can’t be a great movie with something to say, but it’s been pointed out before that a truly superlative adaptation would find a way to comment on the Comic Book Film, much as the original did with its own brethren. Not sure if that’s what Snyder & Co. set out to achieve.
It is meta, but so was The Princess Bride and that was a wonderful movie…they just had to change the meta stylings from commenting on a novel to something they could do in a movie, and they did.
From the looks of it, Snyder IS commenting on the comic book film, which is of course the source of some of the complaints…in that the costumes have been changed to look more like movie costumes (rubber suits) than in the book. And the fact that the first trailer used the Smashing Pumpkins song which was used (in a different version) in what’s regarded as the shittiest comic book movie ever made. It looks very much like SNyder has adapted the material to comment on movie superheroes.
Hey Lex, remember with Daredevil when they had Michael Clarke Duncan play the villain and everyone was freaking out because he was playing a white character in the comics? But what other gigantic, muscular, bald, and very good actor are you going to get to play that role? JUst like Atticus’s tie.
And in adapting novels, Kubrick made a better movie from The Shining than it was a novel in a lot of ways. The tv movie which followed the novel was full of King’s cheese…evil animal hedges? Really? I can’t think of anything less scary. Except for maybe IO.
In 1987 I was 14. I read the Watchmen and loved it. Blew my mind. Unique. Unlike anything I had ever read. One year after Miller’s Dark Knight Returns. The dawn of a new era, etc. BUT… I was 14, let’s reiterate that. Needless to say I still appreciate it, and love it, and respect it, and when I shook Dave Gibbons’s hand at the Con I had my uber-geek moment of the YEAR.
But how does it stand out in 2009, when every literal trope under the sun has been deconstructed, when any kid is more desensitized by age 8 then I was at 18, when our culture has been subject to every single comic book adaptation conceivable… I don’t know. I think WB should worry and worry big.
I just re-read it last week, after at least 7-8 years. It was great feeling 14 again, I was a kid again. I felt the wonder and the joy of discovering a NEW kind of book/story. But I was 14 then.
Is it brilliant? Or is it considered brilliant because it came out in the 80s. I can’t tell anymore. Maybe I’m overly cynical, and I still appreciate a lot about the book, and I’m part of the Watchmen Cult (and proud), but I’m not sure I talk about it without some perspective now.
“And in adapting novels, Kubrick made a better movie from The Shining than it was a novel in a lot of ways. The tv movie which followed the novel was full of King’s cheese…evil animal hedges? Really? I can’t think of anything less scary. Except for maybe IO.”
A posting 70s Afrobush Vagina straight from a 1970s porn finds me scary? Really? You are a vagina that has acquired the skills of thought and typing. If that’s not totally scary. I have no idea what is.
Aris: it tells a tale that’s still fitting today. What if the heroes were assholes? What if everything we believed was bullshit? It’s a rather common place theme in comics, but Watchmen does it better than others.
Oh yeah… if you wanted a movie with the comic Ozymandias costume. You need to share that strain with the world. Help those kids in Kentucky see colours that only are apparently seeing.
Scooter – I think the hard push that starts next week shows WB felt it had enough awareness and didn’t want to let the web rumblings start too early.
Lazarus – that was a good write-up on “unfilmmable”. IMO the Ultimate BR disc that weaves all three parts into one 5-hour piece will be amazing.
As for translating the commentary to fit the medium, Cronenberg is the one to nail this down with dense material. To paraphrase, you have to see it as a continuation of the themes while holding to the narrative, not vice versa which is more standard. Ballard talked about this during the press for Crash and how he saw the movie as a meta-sequel to the book. To try this with Watchmen would have been high risk and the type of thing that would have been hard to recover from if it tanked.
I still say Snyder should have played it safe and grabbed Miller’s Ronin. The A&M would have been a breeze and its opening would have soldified him into the top tier.
That was well thought out, Aris.
If you have not read Watching the Watchmen. Check that book out. It’s a pretty interesting insight into a book that inspirec countless and brought about (with the og TDK) the graphic novel boon. Which has made Hollywood a shit load of money.
Um…IO, maybe you need to go back to remedial reading. When I say you are LESS scary than something, that means that whatever I mentioned first is MORE scary than you.
Now…while I did not come right out and specify that I did not find fictional, walking animal hedges to be non frightening, it was strongly implied by my wording and general sarcastic tone. Crude, cavemen comic book wanker types who don’t have well developed social skills tend to miss subtleties such as this.
However, Knowing this, when I say you are LESS scary than the hedges, and that I don’t find the hedges to be scary at all, then using remedial math, you would deduce that I find you less scary than imaginary walking bushes.
To wit, you are stupid.
To wit; you are a 1970s Afrobush Vagina. You are essentially the talking oragice of Honey Wilder. So please do not act as if you are some smart person, but you are smart for a furry vagina. Now go give your man a French Wooking, and leave the rest of us to have a discussion… you fruity nutcake.
That’s orifice in case Perm lacks the ability to figure out a type. It seems rather plausible that a furry vag would not be able to figure that out, but I am going with the thought that the vag has some sense for a furry vag.
In case Honey Wilder’s vagina was busy eating nachos or something, and missed the above. That’s TYPO. I mean, really, you are a vagina. You have to be walked through some things in your existance. Now go give your man a Sebastian Telfair, and have a pleasant tomorrow.
Guess as far as King’s concerned, if those part-timer hacks Nicholson and Kubrick couldn’t nail it, call in Steven Weber.
Do not mock Steven Weber. He has aged well. Thanks to the black arts known as BEVERLY HILLS PLASTIC SURGERY!
Thank you, Martin.
As far as Ronin is concerned, alongside Watchmen, it is the one other comic book I would love to see adapted. And certainly not by just any director. I’m not sure who would deserve the mantle, but the choices would probably be counted on one hand.
However it, too, is dense and not a terribly commercial story, though the time settings and love story are distinct enough to allow the film version to stand out from the crowd (from a marketing and non-fan potential).
Dark Knight set the bar high, and its success might have allowed the possibility for titles such as Ronin to get the green-light. However, it will be the outcome of Watchmen’s gross which will either usher in a new era in these types of films or be the final nail in the proverbial coffin.
IO has female trouble.
Chris: if that’s a freakin John Waters reference. God bless you. GOD BLESS US EVERYONE!
‘the shining’ is an excellent example of a book-to-film adaptation: king is on record as having absolutely detested kubrick’s screenplay (i believe he tried to have all reference to his name removed from the film, unsuccessfully, someone may know more about that); he hated the way the marriage between jack and wendy is portrayed in the film as bereft right from the start, and how one-note jack’s character is in the film compared to the book, where jack fights tooth and nail to retain his sanity. so in a way, perhaps king represents readers everywhere who are disappointed with the way a story they love and connect with is translated to a different medium.
and yet kubrick’s film is a masterpiece in its own right (imho) of atmosphere, setting, photography and editing, a simple yet terrifying story based only loosely on the book, translated exceptionally well to the big screen. king’s tales are difficult to adapt to film successfully, but ‘the shining’ and ‘the dead zone’ are two excellent examples of how to adapt a novel for the screen effectively.
And like most Kubrick, it had its ass kicked on release (though it did decent box office) and later became A CLASSIC.
Dead Zone flailed at the box office… but so did A Christmas Story.
‘had its ass kicked on release’, you mean by critics, mr. poland? or the competition
Dead Zone and Xmas Story have gone past their box office being relevant, but I catch the hint.
of interest to probably no one but true, nonetheless: at the time of ‘the shining’s original book release i was living in an apartment in a converted residential hotel on whitley in hollywood (i believe it’s still there)…a scary place run by aged twin sisters who were failed actresses, the building had old-fashioned elevators with the pull gates and laundry facilities in a darkish basement that also housed storage cages….the walled in back courtyard had many topiary animals…..my point: ‘the shining’ scared the shit out of me and NOTHING seemed unbelievable…….sorry about being so anecdotal……
anectdotal…oops
I seem to recall Aronofsky being attached to Ronin. It was going to be his first big-budget movie after PI. Anyone else recall this, or was I tripping?(Being that it was Summer ’98, I probably was…)
run by aged twin sisters who were failed actresses…
So, like this in duplicate?
http://images.broadwayworld.com/upload/16030/Carol%20Kane.jpg
JB – DA was on that for sometime. I never understood what happened there. I’ve never understood Aronofsky’s career, for that matter…
Martin: could you expand on that comment please?
martin — very much like that but not quite as regal…this apt. is about a block and a half north of hollywood blvd. and was within walking distance of ‘frederick’s of hollywood’ (before the recent move)..we always figured they got their wigs there….
hey scoot, did the twins landladies ever appear periodically in the hallway and say, ‘come and play with us, scooter (i know, your name’s not scooter), forever…and ever…and ever.’ now that would be cool
scoot: you were right the first time on “anecdotal.”
leah: I believe Dave was referring to The Shining’s critical ass-kicking, hence his parenthetical about decent box office.
IO: Yes it was you’re welcome.
As per THE SHINING, that book scared the shit out of me at age 14, even in the classroom while reading it. I never found Kubrick’s movie scary. Creepy and ominous, but my vision of the book was too vivid, which is a testament to King’s writing and probably why fans are so divided on the film versions. I appreciate Kubrick’s version because it’s him, but I think King’s critique is accurate.
I’d also die to see the stop-motion topiary animals he supposedly filmed — along with a giant Nicholson head splitting open with worms coming out.
because of ‘the shining’, topiary continues to fascinate…we have several animals in the garden but they’re of the small variety (ie:ones i could easily kill if they came to life)…..
and every time i drive by ‘the empty vase’ on santa monica blvd. with their giant topiary stuff, i cringe a little……
‘I’d also die to see the stop-motion topiary animals he supposedly filmed — along with a giant Nicholson head splitting open with worms coming out.’
me, too, christian!
(topiary is creepy because of king. quite an achievement. ‘the shining’ is a terrific book, but i read it after ‘the stand’, which hit me in the gut like a fist when i was 12. nothing will ever even come close for me. the walking dude still strides around in my dreams at night)
The Stand is one of my all-time favorites, too. I had a soft spot for the first couple of Dark Tower books, but there came a point where they seemed to melt into being just like very other orc-slaying fantasy quest novel out there and I lost interest.
I don’t think anyone is claiming that Watchmen will change the world – it’s just a movie.
But I do have a friend who’s seen it (the whole movie, not just a few minutes) and thinks it’s a work of genius.
IO – when PI came out, DA was poised to take off, and he didn’t. He’s had more sputtered projects this side of Gilliam, and I have no idea why. I just find his career sort of free-floating where he dumps a ton of work into certain projects that just whither away.
It’s nothing against him personally or a crack on his talent. Until The Wrestler, you had to question if Robocop would really go anywhere or was it going to be like Ronin, Watchmen, Year One, etc…
IO – by the way, did you see the damage Punisher: War Zone and The Spirit did to Lionsgate? Brutal. I felt bad because anyone whoever saw Robocop 2 knew Miller was in over his head. Poland will link to it at some point.
I rather like seeing Lionsgate take some hits. I don’t know why, but those Saw movies piss me off.
I hear you Aris. I was that 14-yr old.
But as strong as my rose-colored glasses for favorite graphic novels are…there are many things in them I suppose that I would not like the film to be “true to the book”…like the excessively weak Evey in the original V books.
So for every graphic/comic adaptation…I just wait and see, no great expectations…until I see what the heck they did.
I really do hope the pre-screenings come to an end soon. I absolutely HATE hearing anything on a movie before it flies. And test screening audiences are often full of shit and wouldn’t know a good movie anyway.
A selection of views on Watchmen from Comic Con, from people who have actually seen 18 minutes, rather than are just bitter and twisted:
“the footage I’ve seen is AWESOME.”
“get a great audience reaction”
“the watchmen part of the panel was far outshining everything else.”
“Pretty cool first glimpse of the movie which made me really want to see it.”
“this movie is poised to be amazing.”
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/40039
A selection of views on Watchmen from Comic Con, from people who have actually seen 18 minutes, rather than are just bitter and twisted:
“the footage I’ve seen is AWESOME.”
“get a great audience reaction”
“the watchmen part of the panel was far outshining everything else.”
“Pretty cool first glimpse of the movie which made me really want to see it.”
“this movie is poised to be amazing.”
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/40039
From the various Twitters last night, I think it’s safe to say it’s at least very good. The wait to March 6th has become more… difficult.